Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

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illiad
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by illiad »

Julie wrote:Well...it might still meet your definition of "stupid journalist word" but here's a link for you. :)

hey cartoonists aren't journalists!!! :) they have to keep to the fine line given by their web company...
or worse, have those that 'pibgorn' has to put up with... :(
some of the worst journalists will put a similar picture in their 'rag' and know that their 'sheeple' will buy it all up... :x

Silly M...reacting so strongly when it's her own fault for being so dismissive of her friends warnings and comments about her supernatural nature. :P I'm looking forward to seeing them all hash this out.
heh yeah poor girl... she has to face up to reality now.... :roll:
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Fairportfan »

donoho wrote:I miss Monica talking/swearing/etc in teh language her grandmother taught her. :p
Too dangerous with Bud in the room. Might accidentally cause problems.

What if, while in the throes of anger, she yelled "Go {have sexual intercourse with} yourself! How far up your ass have you got your head?"?
Not even duct tape can fix stupid. But it can muffle the noise.
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Fairportfan »

illiad wrote:
Julie wrote:Well...it might still meet your definition of "stupid journalist word" but here's a link for you. :)
hey cartoonists aren't journalists!!! :) they have to keep to the fine line given by their web company...
or worse, have those that 'pibgorn' has to put up with... :(
some of the worst journalists will put a similar picture in their 'rag' and know that their 'sheeple' will buy it all up... :x

Silly M...reacting so strongly when it's her own fault for being so dismissive of her friends warnings and comments about her supernatural nature. :P I'm looking forward to seeing them all hash this out.
heh yeah poor girl... she has to face up to reality now.... :roll:
Nah. She's got a ways to go still; she's not at Lake Victoria yet.
Not even duct tape can fix stupid. But it can muffle the noise.
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donoho
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by donoho »

I think it's important to remember Monica's denial is not natural. She spent Four Years in an institution. She's been hard core conditioned not to believe in the Supernatural. After being pissed wears off (as fear did last week), where will she be on her Supernatural/Scientific stance?
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Bathorys Daughter
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Bathorys Daughter »

chibichibi01 wrote:Hey guys, we got a hint of M's inability to be killed a long time ago. I'm pretty certain she couldn't have even been killed before the shivving. It looks like this has been planned for a while.

I, for one, cannot wait to see where the puppetmaster takes this.
I interpreted that to mean she could not be killed at that moment due to her being entirely opened to being a doorway. The doorway covered, or took the place of, her body so anywhere Shelly stabbed would be in that doorway and not in Monica's body as such. Placing it in the head made the doorway one way (in only). I think it was only after the blade was in place that Monica actually became immortal.
A society should not be judged on how it treats its outstanding citizens but by how it treats its criminals... ~ Fyodor Dostoevsky.
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by sheik »

I don't know if M's clothes are incinerated or simply fell to the floor while she was in her ashen state, but if her regeneration is keyed to her DNA and the proteins produced therefrom she may have one small problem.
We depend on a plethora of commensal bacteria that live in our gut to keep things running smoothly, and those probably did not reconstitute with her.
Ask anyone who had taken a powerful oral antibiotic just what that means.
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Dave »

sheik wrote:I don't know if M's clothes are incinerated or simply fell to the floor while she was in her ashen state, but if her regeneration is keyed to her DNA and the proteins produced therefrom she may have one small problem.
We depend on a plethora of commensal bacteria that live in our gut to keep things running smoothly, and those probably did not reconstitute with her.
Ask anyone who had taken a powerful oral antibiotic just what that means.
So, you're saying between the direct (incinerating) effects of the astral fire, and the indirect (antibiotic) effects, Monica is hot to trot?
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Fairportfan »

donoho wrote:I think it's important to remember Monica's denial is not natural. She spent Four Years in an institution.
Was it four years?

If it was, she must have been hell on wheels in college, since i'd assume she must have at least a Master's degree to hold her job, and she went in at fourteen...

Well, maybe she did a GED and started college at about the regular time.
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Fairportfan »

Dave wrote:
sheik wrote:I don't know if M's clothes are incinerated or simply fell to the floor while she was in her ashen state, but if her regeneration is keyed to her DNA and the proteins produced therefrom she may have one small problem.
We depend on a plethora of commensal bacteria that live in our gut to keep things running smoothly, and those probably did not reconstitute with her.
Ask anyone who had taken a powerful oral antibiotic just what that means.
So, you're saying between the direct (incinerating) effects of the astral fire, and the indirect (antibiotic) effects, Monica is hot to trot?
{Fairportfan stuffs Dave head-first into the Pun Jar.}
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illiad
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by illiad »

sheik wrote:I don't know if M's clothes are incinerated or simply fell to the floor while she was in her ashen state, but if her regeneration is keyed to her DNA and the proteins produced therefrom she may have one small problem.
We depend on a plethora of commensal bacteria that live in our gut to keep things running smoothly, and those probably did not reconstitute with her.
Ask anyone who had taken a powerful oral antibiotic just what that means.
you are forgetting, Monica has nothing to do with a mundane human... more the **Supernatural** - if you can find a book on 'Supernatural biology' please do point us to the source.... :P :)

and while you are there, how golems(who are just hollow clay figures) can eat, go to the loo, get x rayed at hospital, etc with no hint that they are not just very normal people.... :)
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by bmonk »

Jay-Em wrote:
My2Cents wrote:
Jorge wrote:Why is it every time something supernatural happens to one of these girls, they end up naked?
Because the author wants realism rather than to serve the morality police.

Didn’t you love the how the old werewolves shredded all their clothes, but somehow always not their pants?
Yes, indeed thát ^
It's a typical American/Anglo-saxon problem though. (Don't believe me? Read a couple of Euro comics like "Sillage" where éven teen-boobies are on full display. And to boot, those comics/graphic novels are often found in the children's-section of our public libraries... ánd, no children have been emotionally scarred that I know of) There's a really interesting essay on the dichotomy of fragmented Western Culture, and how Anglo-Saxon morality shapes our connected world, in that.
Yes. I just saw a blog that commented on the fact that, nowadays, encouraging Catholic children to admit their sins and actually confess them, be absolved, and do penance might be damaging to their sensitive psyches. All that guilt and evil, you know. Never mind that most kids know they have done wrong, and even appreciate (on some level) having it dealt with and over. . . .
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by bmonk »

Dave wrote:
sheik wrote:I don't know if M's clothes are incinerated or simply fell to the floor while she was in her ashen state, but if her regeneration is keyed to her DNA and the proteins produced therefrom she may have one small problem.
We depend on a plethora of commensal bacteria that live in our gut to keep things running smoothly, and those probably did not reconstitute with her.
Ask anyone who had taken a powerful oral antibiotic just what that means.
So, you're saying between the direct (incinerating) effects of the astral fire, and the indirect (antibiotic) effects, Monica is hot to trot?
The pun jar perked up and looked in your direction for that.
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Dave »

Jay-Em wrote:It's a typical American/Anglo-saxon problem though. (Don't believe me? Read a couple of Euro comics like "Sillage" where éven teen-boobies are on full display. And to boot, those comics/graphic novels are often found in the children's-section of our public libraries... ánd, no children have been emotionally scarred that I know of) There's a really interesting essay on the dichotomy of fragmented Western Culture, and how Anglo-Saxon morality shapes our connected world, in that.
*chuckle*

I hadn't heard of "Sillage" and just looked it up. The U.S. import/translation of this graphic novel, entitled "Wake", has been censored in a typical American fashion... the adolescent lead character's chest has been hidden from view with black felt marker.

It's one of the very strange quirks of American culture, that children are not allowed to see the unclothed human body (even in a non-sexual context), but are permitted to see some very graphic violence, torture, and death (the standards for a "PG-13" movie or game can include some rather gruesome depictions).
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Bathorys Daughter »

Dave wrote:
Jay-Em wrote:It's a typical American/Anglo-saxon problem though. (Don't believe me? Read a couple of Euro comics like "Sillage" where éven teen-boobies are on full display. And to boot, those comics/graphic novels are often found in the children's-section of our public libraries... ánd, no children have been emotionally scarred that I know of) There's a really interesting essay on the dichotomy of fragmented Western Culture, and how Anglo-Saxon morality shapes our connected world, in that.
*chuckle*

I hadn't heard of "Sillage" and just looked it up. The U.S. import/translation of this graphic novel, entitled "Wake", has been censored in a typical American fashion... the adolescent lead character's chest has been hidden from view with black felt marker.

It's one of the very strange quirks of American culture, that children are not allowed to see the unclothed human body (even in a non-sexual context), but are permitted to see some very graphic violence, torture, and death (the standards for a "PG-13" movie or game can include some rather gruesome depictions).
PG-13 also allows for brief nudity. I believe even PG does. It's a misconception that American standards do not allow for nudity in media. Even on daytime TV, full frontal nudity is allowed (in a non-sexual content), it's just rarely shown by convention. Every now and then, in the interests of public education, one daytime talk show or another will show bare breasts when speaking of women examining themselves for cancers. I've even seen one showing a woman's pelvic exam in all it's glory. They give warnings ahead of time, but that doesn't mean someone could not tune in while it's in progress, negating the warnings.

But, yes, I do agree too many parents have a wrong-headed attitude when it comes to killing. Many children see that sort of thing way too young, but I don't think that is confined to just the US.
sheik wrote:I don't know if M's clothes are incinerated or simply fell to the floor while she was in her ashen state, but if her regeneration is keyed to her DNA and the proteins produced therefrom she may have one small problem.
We depend on a plethora of commensal bacteria that live in our gut to keep things running smoothly, and those probably did not reconstitute with her.
Ask anyone who had taken a powerful oral antibiotic just what that means.
As I see it, it's that she is returned to the "state" her body had at the moment the blade "insertion" when it regenerates. That state would probably include everything present at that time. Since we didn't see the process, we don't really know she went entirely to ashes either. Though suddenly having a tan makes you wonder. Could be the tan came from the astral fire and not that she had a tan when they all went on the calendar machine mission.
A society should not be judged on how it treats its outstanding citizens but by how it treats its criminals... ~ Fyodor Dostoevsky.
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by waldosan »

FANSERICE! except it didn't really show anything, leaves more to imagination i guess... one of us needs to add this page to the tv tropes article "barbie doll anatomy"
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Nimrod »

Hmmmm... I just see one big problem with this whole body resets to a particular time / can't die effect.

From what we have seen so far in the last few strips Monica can take surprisingly serious physical damage and essentially regenerate and repair herself. We have seen her frozen and her heart ripped out! From this she appears to spontaneously regenerate automatically.

OK, so why does she remember anything?

You see she is either
1) regenerating the part missing e.g. her heart.
2) regenerating her whole body to a set point.

From what has been shown she must be doing number 2 as she has been flash frozen several times and that does severe body-wide damage. This means that her whole body is getting rebuilt to a set point.

So - if that is so, why does she remember anything after that set point?
She would not - as memory is a physical configuration in the brain. If her body is resetting then her brain is resetting and thus her memories are resetting. Any knowledge is getting expunged along with damage that triggers it.

Unless we see some rather convoluted explanation or none at all (the it is magic excuse) Monica's newly demonstrated regeneration ability has some rather big holes in it.

I hope it is not number 2 at all.

I would also add that if she had this regeneration ability prior to the whole calendar machine events then her entire suicide attempt and all the related back-story just got a great deal less meaningful or significant.
Also - HOW MUCH DAMAGE MUST MONICA GET BEFORE SHE AUTO-RESETS?

Can she be poisoned to death? If so, at what point is she poisoned. Think about her drinking problems - when would the poisonous alcohol trigger a regeneration? Could she get drunk ever again?

Just wanted to mention this before the "explanations" begin.
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Jay-Em »

Yes, well, legends about ancient gods, miracles and magic are also full of holes. Your point being?

I do not see a problem. "Magic" can be anything an author wants. Wanna do better? No-one is stopping You from starting Your own, logically sound, web-comic.
but, why 42?
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Dave »

Nimrod wrote:OK, so why does she remember anything? ... She would not - as memory is a physical configuration in the brain.
Well, if you're going to ask that all of Wapsi Square be explained purely in terms of "reasonable physics as we know it", you're going to be rather frustrated :P

As an intellectual exercise, though, it's fun to tackle the questions you're raised, and try to resolve them within the framework of Wapsi as Paul has shown it to us.

So... memory, and memory loss. There's one good example of memory working as you say it should - Epimetheus/Justin. We've been told that he lost his memory, as the result of a severe skull injury (Excedrin Headache #357 or the like). His brain grew back, but he lost his memories in the process.

We've seen Justin's immortality / healing power at work a couple of times. It appears to be an incremental re-growth process... damaged or destroyed tissues grow back from the parts of his body not destroyed. The man is a (para)human starfish ;) and it seems possible that all of his regrown tissues are in a largely "blank slate" state. So, memory loss isn't unreasonable.

However, Monica's Phoenix immortality seems to work very differently (from what little we've seen of it in action). It looks like a high-energy phenomenon (astral fire, smoke, bright blinky lights, and so forth, and her cussing outdoes Justin's by a mile). It's not just a "re-grow the tissues from either side of the wound", as far as we've seen. The reputation of the Phoenix (one version at least) is that it actually burns itself to ash and is then reborn from the ashes. It may, in Monica's case, be acting as a sort of high-falutin' matter reorganizer - burn the body down to its component elements, and then rebuilt it from a pattern. Clearly, at least part of this pattern is set by her physical state at the time she was stabbed... but this may not be all of what's happening. Presumably, there have been Phoenixes who were never stabbed with a Bia-blade... and yet they managed to regenerate... so, there's room for some flexible thinking here.

It may be that the "Monica pattern" which is used to rebuild her physical form isn't just a static snapshot of her state at stabbing-time, but is somehow dynamically updated... a sort of "tricorder scan" of her memories and brain-state at the time of her "death" could be used as one part of the pattern. And, in this first big regeneration at least, Monica's head and brain were not compromised... so her updated memory pattern would have been completely intact.

What's more - in the Wapsiverse, memory and thought may not be entirely a matter of the physical arrangement of the brain. We've seen that Monica was able to think, remember, and communicate as an incorporeal spirit or ghost or projection, while her body was apparently comatose. We've been led to believe that Wapsi humans do have incorporeal souls which define their identity to some extent - Tina Guzman's soul ended up spackled together with Shelly's demons, creating the hybrid Conscience... whose memories were then erased due to the mis-behavior of the demon coven.

And, for one more example... when Shelly's sphinx-persona returned from the Time Forest, and fused with her human self, her sphinx memories and aura came along... even though it wasn't until quite a bit later that Shelly first morphed into sphinx-form in the main Wapsi timeline.

So, it seems to me that Pablo has created plenty of precedent for what's happening with Monica.
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Wyvern »

donoho wrote:I miss Monica talking/swearing/etc in teh language her grandmother taught her. :p

You mean in 'Glyph' - yes, I thought of that, too. Come to think of it, we haven't seen much Glyph lately at all.
You should be reading the Wapsi Square Wiki.
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Re: Nice and Tan 2012-10-16

Post by Fairportfan »

Wyvern wrote:
donoho wrote:I miss Monica talking/swearing/etc in teh language her grandmother taught her. :p
You mean in 'Glyph' - yes, I thought of that, too. Come to think of it, we haven't seen much Glyph lately at all.
As i said - Monica indulging in certain common unpleasantries in glyph might result in Bud literally attempting to disappear up her own butt.

And i ain't betting she couldn't do it - sort of like the Vacuum Monster in Yellow Submarine...

Potentially ripping a hole in the Very Fabric Of Time And Space Itself.
Not even duct tape can fix stupid. But it can muffle the noise.
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