Wapsi Square Forum

The plot thickens...

Collusion, I say, collusion!

Thickens? It positively congeals!

So . . . they're trying to figure out what Nadette wants to do, and will enjoy.

Some people can be led . . . some have to be beaten semiconscious with a cluebat.

ANd Mrs Starr is right to be concerned . . . handing the company over to someone who's going to have a sudden crisis - or even just a lack of acute interest - is not a good thing for anybody!

That could leave Nadette in an emotional corner where she drives everyone away, then commits suicide because she's alone . . . I've seen it happen.

--FreeFlier

I think the most shocking thing about this update is seeing the Starr family at home, and they are all in human form.

I don't know about anyone else, but when I used to come home from the job that I had to wear business clothes to, the first thing I did when I got home is took them off and got into something more comfortable. The same would go for Berdine's school uniform.

And don't give me any noise about "Maybe they just got home and haven't had a chance to blah blah blah." No. These are ursamorphs, and they can transform instantly. (And yes, technically they aren't wearing "work clothes" or "school uniforms", but as we saw the first time we met them, they have a base form that they are more comfortable wandering around in, and (if Nadette's ears are any indication) those forms are what they revert to naturally.

That third panel puzzles me a little... Sure, I get that Nadette is still afraid of mom and doesn't want to disappoint her, so she does what she thinks mom wants her to do.

In the meantime, that last exchange, are they saying that Berdine DOES want to take over the company?

I think the implication is that if Berdine wanted to take over the company, she would have made it VERY clear to mom by now.

From mom's phrasing, it sounds like she might expect Berdine to, and that Berdine would certainly tell her if she didn't want to.

lake_wrangler wrote:That third panel puzzles me a little... Sure, I get that Nadette is still afraid of mom and doesn't want to disappoint her, so she does what she thinks mom wants her to do.

In the meantime, that last exchange, are they saying that Berdine DOES want to take over the company?

That's how I'm seeing it, and that Nadette is drifting towards the #2 slot.

Also, I don't think Nadette is consciously afraid of her mom, but subconsciously afraid of disappointing her.


Not much doubt as to who is the dominant twin here, is there?

--FreeFlier

FreeFlier wrote:

lake_wrangler wrote:That third panel puzzles me a little... Sure, I get that Nadette is still afraid of mom and doesn't want to disappoint her, so she does what she thinks mom wants her to do.

In the meantime, that last exchange, are they saying that Berdine DOES want to take over the company?

That's how I'm seeing it, and that Nadette is drifting towards the #2 slot.

That's pretty much what I thought, but kept second-guessing myself over whether that was the case or not.

FreeFlier wrote:Also, I don't think Nadette is consciously afraid of her mom, but subconsciously afraid of disappointing her.

That would make more sense...

FreeFlier wrote:Not much doubt as to who is the dominant twin here, is there?

--FreeFlier

Well, Nadette IS the quiet one, after all...

lake_wrangler wrote: . . .

FreeFlier wrote:Not much doubt as to who is the dominant twin here, is there?

Well, Nadette IS the quiet one, after all...

That's not a reliable indicator . . .

--FreeFlier

As I understand it, the pattern is that the submissive one often speaks for the dominant. But, I don't know if this applies here.

Thor wrote:I think the most shocking thing about this update is seeing the Starr family at home, and they are all in human form.

I don't know about anyone else, but when I used to come home from the job that I had to wear business clothes to, the first thing I did when I got home is took them off and got into something more comfortable. The same would go for Berdine's school uniform.

And don't give me any noise about "Maybe they just got home and haven't had a chance to blah blah blah." No. These are ursamorphs, and they can transform instantly. (And yes, technically they aren't wearing "work clothes" or "school uniforms", but as we saw the first time we met them, they have a base form that they are more comfortable wandering around in, and (if Nadette's ears are any indication) those forms are what they revert to naturally.

As I understand it, there are actually folks out there that enjoy wearing business suits and being dressed up all of the time.

Of course, she may just be getting home from work and still has yet to change.

Is there anyone in this family that doesnt need a cluex4 up side the head? They might want to consider that all she wants to do is be the best girl friend and more to Stali

And suspicions of collusion between Ms. Alger and Nadette's mom turn out to be well-founded, with the adults around her trying to get our quiet Seer to have a preference and not just for Atsali. But they're overlooking their two best bets: Berdine, and Atsali herself. Set THEM to poking at Nad' to find out what, if anything, she wants to do with her life, and maybe you'll get results.

Thor wrote:I think the most shocking thing about this update is seeing the Starr family at home, and they are all in human form.

I don't know about anyone else, but when I used to come home from the job that I had to wear business clothes to, the first thing I did when I got home is took them off and got into something more comfortable. The same would go for Berdine's school uniform.

And don't give me any noise about "Maybe they just got home and haven't had a chance to blah blah blah." No. These are ursamorphs, and they can transform instantly. (And yes, technically they aren't wearing "work clothes" or "school uniforms", but as we saw the first time we met them, they have a base form that they are more comfortable wandering around in, and (if Nadette's ears are any indication) those forms are what they revert to naturally.

This startled me, too, at first, but the more I think about it, the more it makes sense. They're in a human style home, with human style (and sized) furnishings and doors. Bears are BIG and heavy and have unretractable claws. You wander around in bear form, you're going to mess up the carpet, break things, and risk getting stuck in doorways. Not to mention, you DON'T want a bear trying to use a human toilet. There may be private rooms and places where they can let their inner bear out, rip up a tire, run like a freight train, and do things in the woods, but when living among humans, you do as humans do. It's not as if she could have used a cell phone easily in bear form, after all.

Gyrrakavian wrote: As I understand it, there are actually folks out there that enjoy wearing business suits and being dressed up all of the time.

Heh.

My friend Joe Celko (major SQL guru - Damn! I know a lot of strange people) says, on his Amazon page:

The rumor that I own only one black suit that I have worn for 30 years is false; I own six identical black suits that I have worn for 30 years.

I've known Joe for forty-five years.
In that time, the only times i've seen him NOT in a three-piece suit generally involved a swimming pool.

What first struck me about Mrs. Starr's appearance is how similar it is to her daughters'.

When Atsali (and the readers) first met the ursamorphs, they were in their furry humanoid form. The first time that they took on fully human form, they were blonde and freckled and Atsali-esque. Atsali freaked out, and they changed over to their current appearance, which they said they "used to use" and knew well.

Now we see that their mother has a very similar appearance. This suggests that this is their standard family appearance; it makes sense that they'd have one, since they'd likely have to interact occasionally with humans who are not aware of the whole paranormal world, and having the family keep looking radically different might be a tad suspicious.

Is this standard family appearance their natural default human appearance, then? Do ursamorphs have a default bear, furry humanoid, and human form that is genetically determined, and any other human forms they take are ones that they just make up?

And why did Berdine and Nadette first decide to take a totally different human appearance with Atsali? Were they bored with their standard family look and were wanting to be different, but were discouraged when Atsali got upset and so they completely gave up on that idea? Or were they so concerned about becoming friends with Atsali that they were willing to forego their usual appearance to put her more at ease, and just didn't realise how their new appearance would upset her?

Gyrrakavian wrote:. . . My friend Joe Celko (major SQL guru - Damn! I know a lot of strange people) says, on his Amazon page:

The rumor that I own only one black suit that I have worn for 30 years is false; I own six identical black suits that I have worn for 30 years.

. . .

My only question is . . .

. . .

Where did he find a suit that will last for 30 years?!

oldmanmickey wrote: . . . They might want to consider that all she wants to do is be the best girl friend and more to Stali

I think they'd actually be okay with that, as long as it's a conscious and thought-through decision. I thinks it's the drifting that concerns them.

Catawampus wrote:What first struck me about Mrs. Starr's appearance is how similar it is to her daughters'.

That struck me when they were at the ER after the sleepover catastrophe, too.

Catawampus wrote:Now we see that their mother has a very similar appearance. This suggests that this is their standard family appearance; it makes sense that they'd have one, since they'd likely have to interact occasionally with humans who are not aware of the whole paranormal world, and having the family keep looking radically different might be a tad suspicious.

It would have to be pretty radical to be suspicious . . . I look so much like a friend that many people think we're brothers (and a few think we're the same person). I look much more like him than any of his brothers do.

But when you get the rest of the family together, you can see the relationships.

Catawampus wrote:Is this standard family appearance their natural default human appearance, then? Do ursamorphs have a default bear, furry humanoid, and human form that is genetically determined, and any other human forms they take are ones that they just make up?

The "default form" might simply be easier to take . . . and it could simply be do to practice.

Catawampus wrote:And why did Berdine and Nadette first decide to take a totally different human appearance with Atsali? Were they bored with their standard family look and were wanting to be different, but were discouraged when Atsali got upset and so they completely gave up on that idea? Or were they so concerned about becoming friends with Atsali that they were willing to forego their usual appearance to put her more at ease, and just didn't realise how their new appearance would upset her?

It could be that they were experimenting . . . the equivalent of dying their hair . . . and decided they didn't like it.

It also might have been associated with having moved and not having any friends here.

--FreeFlier

FreeFlier wrote:

Gyrrakavian wrote:. . . My friend Joe Celko (major SQL guru - Damn! I know a lot of strange people) says, on his Amazon page:

The rumor that I own only one black suit that I have worn for 30 years is false; I own six identical black suits that I have worn for 30 years.

. . .

My only question is . . .

. . .

Where did he find a suit that will last for 30 years?!

Sidney Stratton was a family friend.

Thor wrote:I think the most shocking thing about this update is seeing the Starr family at home, and they are all in human form.

I don't know about anyone else, but when I used to come home from the job that I had to wear business clothes to, the first thing I did when I got home is took them off and got into something more comfortable. The same would go for Berdine's school uniform.

And don't give me any noise about "Maybe they just got home and haven't had a chance to blah blah blah." No. These are ursamorphs, and they can transform instantly. (And yes, technically they aren't wearing "work clothes" or "school uniforms", but as we saw the first time we met them, they have a base form that they are more comfortable wandering around in, and (if Nadette's ears are any indication) those forms are what they revert to naturally.

People observe us a lot more than we are aware of. Maintaining a human form is just a way to keep people from asking embarrassing questions and doing weird things. The time to "let your hair down" is in a secure area, which might not even be one's own bedroom. A school for paras is one such place, but even there one is expected to "lead by example" and at least try to maintain a human form. A little discomfort is a small price to pay for public order, especially if it means blissful ignorance on the part of those not in the know.

oldmanmickey wrote:Is there anyone in this family that doesnt need a cluex4 up side the head? They might want to consider that all she wants to do is be the best girl friend and more to Stali

If that's true, I'd think that her parents would be at least slightly negligent in "letting it go at that" and not having a very serious talk with her.

Defining yourself... and your whole future... entirely in terms of your relationship to one other person is a dangerous path in life. People do die. Even when they don't, people grow and change, and this can lead to a "forever" relationship drifting apart or breaking apart. It can really be a problem when one member of a partnership does continue to grow and change, and the other does not. Also, it can be stifling for one partner in a relationship to realize that he (or she) is entirely in charge of the real-world aspects of their relationship... a steady diet of "Whatever you want, dear" isn't very nutritious

Nadette is at a rather crucial point in her young life... the point of "Well, now that I have the legal right to make choices for myself, what choices are right for me?". This time won't ever come again in her life (unless Ursamorphs carry +5 Wands of Reincarnation). She has an opportunity that, if lost, won't return.

Failing to make a choice is a choice. Her parents are just doing their jobs if they're trying to help her define what choice she's actually going to make. And, regardless of whatever that choice is, they can't be supportive if they don't know what it is because she won't talk about it at all.

Why does everyone think that being in human form is of any problem to ursamorphs? It could be the energy expenditure of transforming from one form to another is the real annoyance.