Wapsi Square Forum

jeffepp wrote:Is it me, or is there a different line style to the artwork?

Also, on the antimatter thing, it could be any size. In fact, a charge larger than one to destroy the tube is unlikely.

About five molecules, then.

Grantwhy wrote:

jeffepp wrote:Is it me, or is there a different line style to the artwork?
Also, on the antimatter thing, it could be any size. In fact, a charge larger than one to destroy the tube is unlikely.

maybe, maybe not.
If Nadette was correct and the antimatter bomb was intended to kill the Nu Gui the bomb is probably a tad larger than one needed to just destroy the tube.
Considering the Nu Gui was in Brandi, and as a golem Bandi should be somewhat resistant to damage, I wonder how large an antimatter bomb would need to be?
(unless antimatter explosions are 100% kills against Nu Gui's regardless of who's body they are inhabiting and how little damage they would take from the explosion?)

Yes, that's what I wonder. I'm surprised a golem can be destroyed by brute force at all. The amount of energy to do that would, I thought, destroy the earth long before it even chips the golem. Although they control vast amounts of energy perhaps they are still susceptible to being broken apart with enough energy directed towards them. OTOH, I thought they had some sort of force field around them as well, allowing them to channel all the energy into protecting their person. Like you said, even a relatively small antimatter explosion may be very effective against a Nu Gui regardless. We'll see.

I wonder how little bear with big fangs is "reading" the senator since she is dead? Stasie probably looks OK at the moment because the stasis chamber is halting any decay, like a cryogenic freezer would. Perhaps you can still die in the chamber if something goes wrong, yet be preserved. That is until you are removed from it and turn to dust.

EDIT: It could be that the stasis chamber was never meant to hold someone for as long as Stasie has been in it, unlike the crystals which have very long term storage capability. Nadette said the tubes were not as stable as the crystals. Stasie may have set the thing to release her in just a few years or even days but something went wrong, perhaps due to the damage to it and she was trapped, dying in her "sleep" at some point. The signal seems to have been designed to lure the Nu Gui to this stasis tube. So the Nu Gui might have been killed even without Brandi's plan to put her/it into a crystal. All in all though, the Nu Gui would have been better off being destroyed by this booby trap than being stored in the crystal.

All of which leads to the questions; How did the senator know about the Nu Gui? Was she also trying to thwart it? Failing that, kill it? Anyway, they are all fortunate Nadette was able to divine what the senator did lest they be drifting vapor now. A good lesson for Atsali that she needs to control that temper of hers. A lesson, judging by her eyes, that is sinking in right about now.

oldmanmickey wrote:The easiest way to do it would be to put a kilo of antimatter in the stasis field. long as she lives the magnetic field is good. she dies, it waits for the field to collapse. When it collapses as soon as air or anything else hit it, boom. no need for a timer no need for anything. well there would be a major need for an exit stage left

A gram or two would be more than quant. suff.

Oh yes, and then there is the matter of the senator wanting to use golems to protect the earth. Seems like a bad idea since a conflict between an army of golems and elder gods would surely destroy the earth in the process. Maybe even flatten the sun. With the World Grid at least you would still have the earth and the solar system, just a few volcanoes and earthquakes. With golems there would be a much greater chance of the entire solar system going poof in the first conflict. Of course there could be the MAD deterrent in play so who knows. Neither side would actually want to destroy the earth. What would be the point in that? Still, things can get out of hand resulting in an outcome neither side really wanted.

That's been something I thought about if humans ever set up thriving habitats on other worlds. As long as Earth is all there is, the powers that be are (so far) careful not to let things get out of hand. But, if that changes, I have to wonder if all out conflict might become much more thinkable since we know humankind will go on elsewhere.

'Sali knew she needed Nadette's vision... but thought she'd need low-light sight.

So - do we call her "Senator Stasie", or do we just call her...


BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMM!

KnightDelight wrote:Oh yes, and then there is the matter of the senator wanting to use golems to protect the earth. Seems like a bad idea since a conflict between an army of golems and elder gods would surely destroy the earth in the process. Maybe even flatten the sun. With the World Grid at least you would still have the earth and the solar system, just a few volcanoes and earthquakes. With golems there would be a much greater chance of the entire solar system going poof in the first conflict. Of course there could be the MAD deterrent in play so who knows. Neither side would actually want to destroy the earth. What would be the point in that? Still, things can get out of hand resulting in an outcome neither side really wanted.

So ... the Ethetians had a choice of cutting off the Earth from 'other places' (the World Grid) or setting up a Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD) scenario, but if the 'enemy' was coming in from 'other places', there would be no guarantee that they could 'assured destruct' their enemy but guarantee to 'destruct' yourself?

Without any obvious negatives, I can see why they went with the World Grid idea.

Yeah, causing the world to go *BOOM* was a negative, but from the sounds of things it would of been only a slight chance of happening (until the Nu Gui made it a certainty)

KnightDelight wrote:

Grantwhy wrote:

jeffepp wrote:Is it me, or is there a different line style to the artwork?
Also, on the antimatter thing, it could be any size. In fact, a charge larger than one to destroy the tube is unlikely.

maybe, maybe not.
If Nadette was correct and the antimatter bomb was intended to kill the Nu Gui the bomb is probably a tad larger than one needed to just destroy the tube.
Considering the Nu Gui was in Brandi, and as a golem Bandi should be somewhat resistant to damage, I wonder how large an antimatter bomb would need to be?
(unless antimatter explosions are 100% kills against Nu Gui's regardless of who's body they are inhabiting and how little damage they would take from the explosion?)

Yes, that's what I wonder. I'm surprised a golem can be destroyed by brute force at all. The amount of energy to do that would, I thought, destroy the earth long before it even chips the golem. Although they control vast amounts of energy perhaps they are still susceptible to being broken apart with enough energy directed towards them. OTOH, I thought they had some sort of force field around them as well, allowing them to channel all the energy into protecting their person. Like you said, even a relatively small antimatter explosion may be very effective against a Nu Gui regardless. We'll see.

KnightDelight wrote:All of which leads to the questions; How did the senator know about the Nu Gui? Was she also trying to thwart it? Failing that, kill it?

well ... if Ethetians has good knowledge about Nu Guis (master manipulators etc) then in theory, there would be patterns in events that, over time, might suggest the existence of a Nu Gui.

That or someone might have stumbled across information that gave away the Nu Gui's existence (heh - now I'm imagining Ethetian versions of Scully & Mulder^) and the Senator was one of those that got the info.

They'd probably had no idea who was hosting it though. Otherwise they'd have used an antimatter device on Brandi the first chance they got?


^ for the artistically inclined, drawing Atsali as Mulder and Nadette as Scully might be an interesting challenge

All this - Nadette suddenly knowing all about Ethetian civilization and politics, the anti-matter bomb, Senator Bomber Queen and that she's dead (but IS she?), and how vicious the little bear can be when she has to be - is VERY interesting. And a bit scary.

But the best part is she managed to snap Atsali out of Attack Mode by words alone. That's love.

(With an anti-matter bomb on site, completely destroying the complex and any memories contained in it suddenly becomes much easier. SURVIVING destroying the complex gets a bit more uncertain.

Maybe they need to call on Aunt Bud or Brandi.)

Opus the Poet wrote:I think Atsali's "Orphan Annie" vibe is related to the "Antimatter Bomb" that just figuratively got dropped in her lap.

So, Nadette figuratively dropped a literal bomb in Atsali's lap?

Thor wrote:Link

What's with Little Orphan Atsali in the last panel?

[/url]

That friends is the classic "blue screen of death" look; where information overload has seriously scrambled the the thoughts processor and exceeded the capacity of the person to process data. She will reboot shortly. . . .might need a "Gibb's slap" to the back of the head though. Just sayin....

Thor wrote:

DilyV wrote:Okay... just doing a little research on matter/antimatter collisions I found this:

1kg of antimatter will annihilate 1kg of matter and release 2c 2 (2c squared where c=constant) =1.8×10 17 (1.8 times 10 to the 17th power) joules of energy. To put this in perspective, this is enough energy to melt about 10 11 (10 to the 11th power) kg of granite. For comparison the weight of Mount Everest is about 10 15 kg (10 to the 15th power), so it wouldn't cause wholesale melting of the Earth. In fact the energy of the meteor that killed the dinosaurs is estimated at 4×10 23 joules (4 times 10 to the 23 power), so while I wouldn't want to be near the antimatter when it annihilated, it's unlikely to wipe out all life on Earth.

This being said, simply put, while the resulting matter annihilation and energy release might not totally destroy the planet, the energy release from just 2.2 pounds (1 kg) of antimatter reacting with an equal amount of matter would put a dent in the planet the size of mount Everest or damn near it. Depending on the propagation of the reaction and the type of energy release (heat, blast and radiation) a reaction that big would probably knock the planet off axis, alter its orbit and otherwise contaminate the atmosphere with fall out magnitudes worse than the meteor collision that killed the dinosaurs.

NOW you see why Atsali is almost in TILT mode.

But all that was said is "anti-matter bomb", with no indication of how large the reaction mass (anti-mass?) is. It might be just a pinhead of anti-matter. We don't know. All we know is that "anti-matter bomb" sure sounds scary.

My post wasn't so much to opine on the size of the device as it was to show the reactivity of a matter/antimatter reaction. While a kilo of antimatter annihilates a like amount of matter initially, it is the energy release from the reaction that makes the area of effect much much greater. Energy release from even that pinhead amount you quoted would be enough to destroy the complex and the surrounding bedrock and desert out to a mile or so.

meisdadoo wrote:

Thor wrote:Link

What's with Little Orphan Atsali in the last panel?

[/url]

That friends is the classic "blue screen of death" look; where information overload has seriously scrambled the the thoughts processor and exceeded the capacity of the person to process data. She will reboot shortly. . . .might need a "Gibb's slap" to the back of the head though. Just sayin....

Dont think its a matter of the Nu Gui surviving the brute force of the explosion so much as if the antimatter hits then its converted to energy and becomes part of the explosion. As far as the "Gibb slap" for Atsali goes i will use an old saying of my dear departed daddy, It would be safer to try an sand paper a wild cats ass then mess with that.







'

DilyV wrote:I don't believe the "senator" is dead. If she'd died, she'd have suffered the ravages of time on her body. She looks fresh as the day she entered the tube.

It could be that the stasis tubes were only partially effective at keeping their contents stable. Sort of like how programs on computers can gradually accumulate errors until they no longer function. The contents may still look to be in fairly decent shape on a cursory glance, but it only takes a little bit of things being "off" for a person to no longer be functional.

Or Nadette could be wrong, or misleading. Or the woman might be dead, yet still capable of action. . .

Catawampus wrote:

DilyV wrote:I don't believe the "senator" is dead. If she'd died, she'd have suffered the ravages of time on her body. She looks fresh as the day she entered the tube.

It could be that the stasis tubes were only partially effective at keeping their contents stable. Sort of like how programs on computers can gradually accumulate errors until they no longer function. The contents may still look to be in fairly decent shape on a cursory glance, but it only takes a little bit of things being "off" for a person to no longer be functional.

Or Nadette could be wrong, or misleading. Or the woman might be dead, yet still capable of action. . .

"That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even death may die."

DilyV wrote:While a kilo of antimatter annihilates a like amount of matter initially, it is the energy release from the reaction that makes the area of effect much much greater. Energy release from even that pinhead amount you quoted would be enough to destroy the complex and the surrounding bedrock and desert out to a mile or so.

For comparison... Wikipedia cites information from The Effects of Nuclear Weapons, Third Edition in saying that the Little Man bomb which detonated at Hiroshima converted somewhere around 0.6 grams of the bomb's mass of uranium into energy, resulting in an explosion equivalent to around 15 kilotons of TNT.

A similar yield resulted from the AFAP (ask me if I'm glad that none of these were ever fired in anger ).

So, a kilogram of antimatter, coming into contact with matter, would convert a total of 2000 grams into energy, for a total energy release of about 3,000 times that of the Hiroshima bomb, or around 50 megatons. That's approximately the yield of the "Tsar bomba", a three-stage thermonuclear bomb which was the largest nuclear weapon known to have ever been detonated on Earth.

A "pinhead" amount of antimatter would probably weight a few milligrams, with a yield well under a kiloton. Bigger than an M65 Davy Crockett, smaller than an AFAP. It would certainly make a mess of the complex.

EDIT: Would this all mean that the code-name for an 25-kT-equivalent antimatter bomb, sufficient to vaporize the entire remaining Mapimi complex and blow the dusty remains out through the bedrock, would be a "gram cracker"? (Deposits one gram of Hafnium 178m2 into the Pun Jar... very carefully.)

DilyV wrote:Nadette's hair deflated! hehehe Cute.

Now, about that Anti Matter bomb... if it went off, there would be nothing but a smoking hole where this installation is... and that would have included the installation above it that got melted down. I don't believe the "senator" is dead. If she'd died, she'd have suffered the ravages of time on her body. She looks fresh as the day she entered the tube. If the tube had just been tampered with, killing the senator, the anti matter device would have detonated and there would be a smokin' hole where this installation was. For a race of people that technologically advanced, I can't believe that the detonation of that anti matter device would have been on a timer... it should have been instantaneous. If not... once again, Atsali is racing against time.

Considering the anti-mater bomb, we know she's no saint (google"incorruptible corpses"), so perhaps it's some sort of preservative keeping her skin intact and possibly preventing mummification.

Also, from the look of Sali, we might get to hear from yhe senator.

Gyrrakavian wrote:

DilyV wrote:Nadette's hair deflated! hehehe Cute.

Now, about that Anti Matter bomb... if it went off, there would be nothing but a smoking hole where this installation is... and that would have included the installation above it that got melted down. I don't believe the "senator" is dead. If she'd died, she'd have suffered the ravages of time on her body. She looks fresh as the day she entered the tube. If the tube had just been tampered with, killing the senator, the anti matter device would have detonated and there would be a smokin' hole where this installation was. For a race of people that technologically advanced, I can't believe that the detonation of that anti matter device would have been on a timer... it should have been instantaneous. If not... once again, Atsali is racing against time.

Considering the anti-mater bomb, we know she's no saint (google"incorruptible corpses"), so perhaps it's some sort of preservative keeping her skin intact and possibly preventing mummification.

Also, from the look of Sali, we might get to hear from yhe senator.

To quote the old film clip of Astronaut Jose' Jimiez: "Oh, I hope not..."

Here: about 1:30

jwhouk wrote:So - do we call her "Senator Stasie", or do we just call her...


BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMM!

... she ain't stacked enough to be called "BOOM Boom"