On The Path 2015-1-5

[Hvitrvarg]

Just like Atsali doesn't really want the "Queen Bee" status, I get the feeling that Nadette is not too keen on being a seer, at this point in time... Finding the balance between telling your friends what they want/need to hear at this time, and telling them more, which they may not be ready to hear, would be quite the task indeed...

It is not easy having gedspeki, or foresight. The question of "Who wants to live forever" could be changed to "Who wants to know the future". Those with Gedspeki live tortured lives, they see the events both good and bad of everyone they know all to clear. I have gedspeki and it is horrible. I wish Atsali luck and Nadette I wish strength, she is going to need it or she will go insane.

[Dr. Otter]

Atsali/Jacob may be doomed to fail, but they both can grow from it, and they need to.

When I think about my life now at 57 years old and what it would have been had I stayed with my first girlfriend (or the second, third, fourth...), I shudder. It's not only likely they will break up, it is almost certain that it is desirable that they do so.

[zachariah]

Given their natures I suspect the relationship will last until they are both satyr-fied.

Drop "Joy of Sex" into the jar.

[eee]

Twicksy Seer.

If Atsali's increased courage would eventually lead to HER, though, you'd think Nadette would be a bit happier...

"Heh, yes! Just like I said, 'by meeting my friend, your brother will find happiness.' He has met Atsali, he is destined for. . ."

For. . .Berdine? Cricket? Castela? Bia? Katherine (awkward!)? Nudge? Place your bets now!

He's a satyr. It could be ALL of them, and Monica, too.

[lake_wrangler]

For Nadette, it may very well come down to trust. How can she expect Atsali to trust her, in the future, once Atsali knows that Nadette was seeing a complex future, and being dishonest with her about it? No, Nadette isn't lying - she's not saying an untrue thing - but she isn't telling the whole truth, either. This may seriously color Atsali's feelings towards her once the full truth does come out... and if Nadette does harbor a hope that Atsali's affections will turn towards her at some point, things could become really complicated.

The ethics and responsibilities of being a Seer... if Nadette is as young as she appears, then this would be a heavy burden even when her own personal feelings aren't directly involved.

This isn't the first time that a character has had to worry about this sort of problem, either.

Interesting... That comic was not the one I thought you were sending out to... Reading your sentence, I thought you were sending us here...

[Sgt. Howard]

Has anyone else noticed that Nadette's first statement is unfinished? SHE knows were Jacob will find happiness, but Randi doesn't allow her to say...

[Akeche]

I'd personally like to thank Nadette for revealing Chekov's Torpedo as the Good Doomed Ship S.S. Jacsali slips out of dry dock into stormy waters.

I'm quite pleased.

EDIT: This also helps explain how Nadette could act so carefree and nonchalant about setting up her crush with Goatsy the Barista.

Jesus I seriously don't know what's wrong with you man xP. You're also celebrating a bit too early here. Let's put a young Monica in Atsali's shoes with Nadette as a friend instead. Young teen M is given the nerves to ask young teen Kevin out. Nadette sees it won't last... But it lasts ten years.

[lake_wrangler]

I'd personally like to thank Nadette for revealing Chekov's Torpedo as the Good Doomed Ship S.S. Jacsali slips out of dry dock into stormy waters.

I'm quite pleased.

EDIT: This also helps explain how Nadette could act so carefree and nonchalant about setting up her crush with Goatsy the Barista.

Jesus I seriously don't know what's wrong with you man xP. You're also celebrating a bit too early here. Let's put a young Monica in Atsali's shoes with Nadette as a friend instead. Young teen M is given the nerves to ask young teen Kevin out. Nadette sees it won't last... But it lasts ten years.

Hear, hear!

The way I see it, Thor's attitude towards Jacob is beyond his argued "I see nothing to like in Jacob", but has rather gone into antipathy, dislike and disdain, which are totally unwarranted, as far as I'm concerned.

In the past, Paul has spent a considerable time developing each character, so it is clearly much too early to conclude anything serious about Jacob, in the comparatively short time that we have seen him. Much less dislike him as thoroughly as Thor seems to be doing.

I may be wrong, here, but I seem to recall Thor going into detail as to how he saw it as a bad thing to have more male characters into this story... I get the feeling that he is projecting that attitude about the comic in general towards Jacob in particular, before we have enough data to know how we should feel about him.

Frankly, it is indeed starting to get annoying. It seems to me that it's going beyond simply defending an unpopular opinion (he was complaining, earlier, that people were coming down on him because he didn't like a character that most other forum members seemed to either like or at least not pass judgement on until more data was available). I also recall him saying that if pushed, he usually tends to double down... looks to me like he's quadrupling down, at the very least...


Me? As much as I would like to see this remain more about Monica and Shelly, I acknowledge that the comic has gone into a new direction, and can see why (only so much more room for M & Co to grow from where they've reached, etc., as has been discussed in the past). So I will simply continue reading and be surprised and entertained by wherever the story goes. And unless a character is clearly written as someone to be disliked, I will not dislike any character in particular. I will not automatically love any new character, either, but will give anyone the chance to grow on me.

[AnotherFairportfan]

Interesting... That comic was not the one I thought you were sending out to... Reading your sentence, I thought you were sending us here...

Wow. How much Phix knew that she couldn't tell Monica then ... and how much she didn't know...

[Dave]

This isn't the first time that a character has had to worry about this sort of problem, either.

Interesting... That comic was not the one I thought you were sending out to... Reading your sentence, I thought you were sending us here...

And the sort of reaction you can get when you Know Things, But Don't Tell, can be even stronger than that. I'm not sure Atsali would use such strong language to Nadette, but she still might be upset if she feels that Nadette deliberately set her up to take a fall.

Nadette isn't just a Seer... she's Atsali's closest and most intimate friend. It will be interesting to see if (or hiw much) the consequences of Nadette's decision to tell half of what she Sees, stresses their friendship.

[Thor]

I'd personally like to thank Nadette for revealing Chekov's Torpedo as the Good Doomed Ship S.S. Jacsali slips out of dry dock into stormy waters.

I'm quite pleased.

EDIT: This also helps explain how Nadette could act so carefree and nonchalant about setting up her crush with Goatsy the Barista.

Jesus I seriously don't know what's wrong with you man xP. You're also celebrating a bit too early here. Let's put a young Monica in Atsali's shoes with Nadette as a friend instead. Young teen M is given the nerves to ask young teen Kevin out. Nadette sees it won't last... But it lasts ten years.

I'm celebrating being proven to be partially right. Given that so many people were saying that I was utterly wrong, is it horrible that I might be feeling a tiny bit vindicated?

I may be wrong, here, but I seem to recall Thor going into detail as to how he saw it as a bad thing to have more male characters into this story... I get the feeling that he is projecting that attitude about the comic in general towards Jacob in particular, before we have enough data to know how we should feel about him.

You remember this, but you don't recall me making an exhaustive list of the male characters of this comic and listing their positive attributes? Why so selective?

Frankly, it is indeed starting to get annoying. It seems to me that it's going beyond simply defending an unpopular opinion (he was complaining, earlier, that people were coming down on him because he didn't like a character that most other forum members seemed to either like or at least not pass judgement on until more data was available). I also recall him saying that if pushed, he usually tends to double down... looks to me like he's quadrupling down, at the very least...

What is it about my opinions that, to you, justifies you making personal attacks on me? Can we not just restrict ourselves to talking about the characters and the comic, and not descend into taking pot-shots at each other? I'm really not asking for more than basic civility.

[lake_wrangler]

I'd personally like to thank Nadette for revealing Chekov's Torpedo as the Good Doomed Ship S.S. Jacsali slips out of dry dock into stormy waters.

I'm quite pleased.

EDIT: This also helps explain how Nadette could act so carefree and nonchalant about setting up her crush with Goatsy the Barista.

Jesus I seriously don't know what's wrong with you man xP. You're also celebrating a bit too early here. Let's put a young Monica in Atsali's shoes with Nadette as a friend instead. Young teen M is given the nerves to ask young teen Kevin out. Nadette sees it won't last... But it lasts ten years.

I'm celebrating being proven to be partially right. Given that so many people were saying that I was utterly wrong, is it horrible that I might be feeling a tiny bit vindicated?

Given that, so far, Paul has never (that I recall) written any throw-away character, I think it is much too early to celebrate anything... And like Akeche wrote, it took ten years (our time) before Kevin was dumped by Monica... Sure, it looked like it would be a successful relationship, while we do have hints that this one won't last (though the hints come from another character, seer though she be), if you look strictly at Atsali and Jacob, there is no reason to think that the relationship won't last. Besides, even if they do eventually break up, we will have to have had time to see the relationship build up and flourish for a while (I doubt it would be so dysfunctional as to not even flourish, at first), before we see cracks appear. Give it time. You may be served, in the end, but it will take a while before that happens. Just let the story flow, and don't be such a downer...

I may be wrong, here, but I seem to recall Thor going into detail as to how he saw it as a bad thing to have more male characters into this story... I get the feeling that he is projecting that attitude about the comic in general towards Jacob in particular, before we have enough data to know how we should feel about him.

You remember this, but you don't recall me making an exhaustive list of the male characters of this comic and listing their positive attributes? Why so selective?

A) I recall the list being made, though I didn't recall it being made by you. However, B) that still doesn't take away from the fact that you still didn't think there was a need for more male characters

In other words, it has nothing to do with selective memory. I was not saying you are unable to see any good in any male character in Wapsi Square (and you've just proven you can, by reminding me that the list of positive attributes in previous and current male characters was yours), nor was I trying to imply such. I was merely pointing out that your current negative feelings and attitude towards Jacob seems rather strong, for a character that was introduced so recently (i.e. we have not had time to see much of what he's like), that it would seem logical to the observer to think that such a negative attitude would come, rather, from your previously expressed opinion of not needing other male characters around. I can see someone being "unimpressed" with Jacob so far, seeing as we have not seen anything to make him really shine, or anything, but neither have we yet seen anything worthy of such doom and gloom pronouncements, or such a negative attitude towards him in general.

Frankly, it is indeed starting to get annoying. It seems to me that it's going beyond simply defending an unpopular opinion (he was complaining, earlier, that people were coming down on him because he didn't like a character that most other forum members seemed to either like or at least not pass judgement on until more data was available). I also recall him saying that if pushed, he usually tends to double down... looks to me like he's quadrupling down, at the very least...

What is it about my opinions that, to you, justifies you making personal attacks on me? Can we not just restrict ourselves to talking about the characters and the comic, and not descend into taking pot-shots at each other? I'm really not asking for more than basic civility.

Actually, I believe I am quite civil. In all that I have written, never have I implied anything derogatory about you as a person, or your attributes, such as your intelligence, or anything else.

It's just like when Atsali says to someone "you said the 'F' word"... is she calling them bad? NO. She is merely pointing out something about their current behavior (in her case, their speech), that may not be appropriate. In the same manner, I am pointing out that your attitude towards Jacob seems to go beyond what is called for given the current information available about him, wondering about the motives behind it, and expressing the fact that expressing negativity to that extent is becoming annoying to read. If that feels like a personal attack, I'm sorry. That certainly was not my intent. But really, calling him "Goatsy the Barista" does not seem very civil (the name does sound like that shock website with a similar name, whether you intended it that way or not - please note I have no idea what is exactly on that similarly named website, but I only heard poor things about it...), and rejoicing over the impending doomed relationship just seems a little too much, too soon. Pointing that out should not be seen as a personal attack.

Yes, we are talking about the characters in a comic, yes, people will have differing opinions and feelings about it. But there are ways of expressing those opinions without taking it too far. Sure, if Atsali and Jacob ever crash and burn spectacularly, you would be right to say 'I told you so', then (though not now, it's too soon to tell). But on the other hand, if the relationship slowly builds up, and eventually falls apart in an organic manner, please don't rub our noses in it. We can live with differing opinions. It's the level of intensity with which you are expressing that differing opinion, which is annoying.

In other words, chill out. Relax, read the story and wait and see where it's going. You've already made it clear you don't like him, and you don't think they should get together. But that does not mean you should be dancing in the streets at the slightest hint that their romance might not be as idyllic as some would like it to be... And in the meantime, there is no reason to denigrate any character in the comic that has not been obviously written to be an antagonist (please refer to comment about 'Goatsy the Barista, above). (And even then, it would probably still be impolite to do so...)

Peace.

[Dave]

But really, calling him "Goatsy the Barista" does not seem very civil (the name does sound like that shock website with a similar name, whether you intended it that way or not - please note I have no idea what is exactly on that similarly named website, but I only heard poor things about it...)

Trust me, it's definitely in the You Do Not Want To Know category

Maybe not quite as bad as what Atsali is remembering, but it's certainly one of those "should not be seen because it cannot be unseen" things.

[TazManiac]

"Goatsy the Barista"

Stepping outside the context of the back and forth (of which I have no desire to get in the middle of) I actually was going to post that I found that funny.

But then I had forgotten about Goatse... (note different spelling.)

Goatse is a defining reason to have enabled SafeSearch in Google Images... (shudder...) oh and (Why, oh WHY did I click that link!?)

Trust me, if you haven't seen it, don't go looking for it.
This is one of those things that people tell you, you are better off without.
Listen to them.
If you feel you must, limit it to text descriptions.

Jacob has likely knocked somebody down, if not altogether out, for trying that nickname on him. You thought calling Cricket/Calista 'Jiminy" was bad? huh...

PS- Paul?, don't put it in the strip plz, not even in passing... plz, plz, plz...

I'm going to brain-bleach myself and stick (minimally in any case) to Goatsy, as in goatsy-wotesy, cutie-pie...

[Sidhekin]

"Goatsy the Barista"

Goatse is a defining reason to have enabled SafeSearch in Google Images... (shudder...) oh and (Why, oh WHY did I click that link!?)

Trust me, if you haven't seen it, don't go looking for it.

What, too gutsy?

... sheesh ...

[Yamara]

"Goatsy the Barista"

But then I had forgotten about Goatse... (note different spelling.)

Goatse is a defining reason to have enabled SafeSearch in Google Images... (shudder...) oh and (Why, oh WHY did I click that link!?)

Trust me, if you haven't seen it, don't go looking for it.
This is one of those things that people tell you, you are better off without.
Listen to them.

How did we get to Goatse? Surely the Cannot Be Unseen Meme for this episode is "Two Girls and an L Cup".

[Thor]

In the interests of not having this blow up into forum drama, I'm going to agree to disagree with you on most points, but I will take issue with a few minor matters.

Given that, so far, Paul has never (that I recall) written any throw-away character, I think it is much too early to celebrate anything...

We haven't heard anything from Yummy Tea since the short arc involving him. Same with Monica's Mexican family. And there have been quite a few placeholder characters, like the vampires' former boss who appeared for about 3 strips, or Pickle's kindergarten teacher, or the guy Katherine ran into on the beach, or Lakhshmi's protective sister. Nothing saying that Jacob can't fade back into the ether after he provides whatever lesson Atsali needs to learn.

if you look strictly at Atsali and Jacob, there is no reason to think that the relationship won't last.

It's kind of premature to call the scant time that Atsali and Jacob have spent together a "relationship". They've spent about 5 minutes together, and half of that was Atsali reading him the riot act.

I was merely pointing out that your current negative feelings and attitude towards Jacob seems rather strong, for a character that was introduced so recently (i.e. we have not had time to see much of what he's like), that it would seem logical to the observer to think that such a negative attitude would come, rather, from your previously expressed opinion of not needing other male characters around.:

Fair enough, though the subjects are only superficially related. Wapsi Square has been carrying on quite well with its historic female-to-male ratio, which would seem to obviate the argument that the strip "needs" greater male representation. But if Mr. Taylor believes that the strip is well-served by the introduction of another male character, I am not going to gainsay him. However, I will say that the character he has added is not pleasing in mine eyes. So far, Jacob is a whole lot of meh. The few times he has opened his mouth he has succeeded in admitting his own inadequacy; whining about his circumstances and further expounding on his inadequacies; actually saying something innocuous; and interrupting, jumping to conclusions, and allowing himself to be cowed into a meeting. Not exactly the behavior of a character I want to spend a lot of time with, which is what he would become if he and Atsali actually become a "thing".

Compare his introduction to the first time we meet Katherine. Over the course of those 10 strips, she is happy, sad, funny, and mysterious. An interesting blend of positive and negative traits. A much greater dynamic range than what has been offered by Mopey Goat. Or take the more recent introduction to the ursamorph twins. Even though they were acting like jerks in the first strip we see them in, they immediately turn that around, give us interesting back story, and are fun and engaging enough that we look forward to seeing them again as part of Atsali's entourage.

But really, calling him "Goatsy the Barista" does not seem very civil (the name does sound like that shock website with a similar name, whether you intended it that way or not - please note I have no idea what is exactly on that similarly named website, but I only heard poor things about it...), and rejoicing over the impending doomed relationship just seems a little too much, too soon.

Being civil with forumites is important because they are real people. Jacob is not going to get his feelings hurt no matter what I call him. And if I rejoice, it's because I like Atsali and I don't want to see her saddled with the likes of Jacob. See, Atsali is an awesome character. She has both strong points and obvious flaws. Even when she's acting like a muffinhead, you still root for her because you know that she is greater than the sum of her current behavior. Our experience with Jacob so far *is* the sum of his current behavior, and that sum is not a positive number. Compare him to his sister, Randi. Randi talks and appears for about the same amount of time as her brother, and she's already far more appealing. She's trying to help her brother out, even though he's a grumpy recluse, going so far as to conspire with Nadette in an effort to hook him up. We might question her intentions, methods, or motivations, but on the whole she comes out clearly positive and is a character one might look forward to finding out more about.

there is no reason to denigrate any character in the comic that has not been obviously written to be an antagonist

Yeah, I really have to disagree with you there. If a "good guy" acts like a jerk-ass, then not mentioning it because they are a "good guy" is silly. Especially in this comic which, despite the supernatural elements, is very slice-of-life--no real heroes or villains, just a bunch of normal people going about their daily business, rubbing elbows and occasionally butting heads. The last out-and-out antagonist was the supernatural thing that was possessing Brandi, and that was over a year ago. And before that was the Calendar Machine. And before that, nothing really. If we don't discuss the flaws of our protagonists and supporting cast, there is very little for us to actually talk about here.

[Gyrrakavian]

If Atsal didn't have that amulet, her wingspan right now would make a California Condor jealous...

If she didn't just loose her true form all-together.

[Gyrrakavian]

I'd personally like to thank Nadette for revealing Chekov's Torpedo as the Good Doomed Ship S.S. Jacsali slips out of dry dock into stormy waters.

I'm quite pleased.

EDIT: This also helps explain how Nadette could act so carefree and nonchalant about setting up her crush with Goatsy the Barista.

Things tend to be a bit clearer when one doesn't obsess over a `ship.

Apologies if I sound like an asshole, but 15 hour shifts are a beast. I'm finally off and heading to bed.

[Gyrrakavian]

Is it possible for one of the bear-folk, to look a bit sheep-ish? 'cause that's how Nadette looks to me in the first frame.

Agreed, lake_wrangler, Nadette doesn't seem too very happy about her role here. I have a hunch that part of it is the fact that although she's set Jacob and Atsali on a path to eventual happiness, she probably knows that they're both in for some turmoil and pain on the way there... and all three of them will probably end up paying a price for that pain.

For Nadette, it may very well come down to trust. How can she expect Atsali to trust her, in the future, once Atsali knows that Nadette was seeing a complex future, and being dishonest with her about it? No, Nadette isn't lying - she's not saying an untrue thing - but she isn't telling the whole truth, either. This may seriously color Atsali's feelings towards her once the full truth does come out... and if Nadette does harbor a hope that Atsali's affections will turn towards her at some point, things could become really complicated.

The ethics and responsibilities of being a Seer... if Nadette is as young as she appears, then this would be a heavy burden even when her own personal feelings aren't directly involved.

Well said!