Wapsi Square Forum

Fairportfan wrote: I predict that about Wednesday Atsali is gonna go "Wait - She's WHAT?!?"

Grantwhy wrote:[

Opus the Poet wrote:Ninja'ed. Doesn't anyone sleep around here?

It's 5.30pm (ish) here - why would I be asleep

DilyV wrote:Poor Tina is totally out of her normal range of experience. I should say that Tina's demons are out of their range of experience... experiencing an expanded range of experience... Definitely Tina 3.0... 2.9999 if the tentacle is still in the tub.

I just erased a whole paragraph because the complete and utter contradiction of what seems to be happening here has got my mind working in circles. The whole thing defies logic as we know it anyway...

1. Tina is killed in an automobile accident as a result of her demons conspiring with other demons and/or Jin as I understand it... That is true. Tina, Monica, and Shelly's demons were all part of that bit. Tina's demons were helping the others to block the doorway. They were also the reason Tina hit the bus to deflect it from truely fatal impact on Monica.

2. Tina's soul left her body, but couldn't get through the doorway because it was blocked so she was melded with Shelly's demon to become Conscience. --- Tina's soul did go through the doorway. That is why the demons were punished. Shelly's and Monica;s demons were not punished as their persons survived.

3. As a result of harming their host, Tina's demons were punished by removing their memories. Absolutely correct.

4. Tina's demons, at the behest of Nudge, reanimate Tina's body and get her up and moving from the morgue. Somehow, they track down Tina's place in Miami and find evidence that she's the daughter of a drug king pin. Somewhere along the line, she settles in Wapsi square and opens Mucho Mocha. -- It has been hinted at she was in the witness protection program until they thought she died. After that we don't know how she got to Wapsi. It is easy to suspect Nudge managed that part.

5. Somewhere along the line, Tina's demons gain a conscience and morals... though they have no memory other than they've been punished. -- They are in the process of gaining a conscience and morals. It doesn't happen quickly for them. Each step is marked by their actions and how they behave. At this state they are becoming even more. Expect the process to accelerate now.

6. At night, she's an empty shell (do we know where her demons go?) -- Like the 400 pound canary. Anywhere they want.

7. At Dawn, spiders crawl into her eye sockets, she wakes up and the spiders are burned to a crisp as Tina wakes up. -- Only seen that happen once. Never explained why it happened.

Okay, knowing all the above, We've been shown that Tina sleeps... so wouldn't it stand to reason her demons knows what sleep is? If I'm not mistaken, I can distinctly remember some of her demons trying to wake up another of her demons, to the point of singing "On top of old smokey..." -- No they didn't sleep until now. The singing was to get the other demons to cooperate in getting the body up and moving. Even demons can be lazy at times.

also, hasn't she perceived the cold, seen it snow? So it stands to reason that the demons have experienced things on a more human rather than quantum level. As someone else said, her broken arm for example. -- She has experienced them so she knows a lot about the body and its reactions by now. That doesn't mean they mean anything to her. We have never seen her dressed warmly once. So she may know cold but it may not bother her. Like it doesn't bother Bud. One point is that she knows pain but there is no hint she has ever know pleasure. As a coven of demons how could that aspect of human life have any meaning to her.

There is a huge discontinuity in Tina's ability to perceive, or things have gone really wonky for her. -- Of course things have gone wonky for her. At this point things like dreams are like an LSD trip to a human the first time. Until you learn to cope with altered reality how can you.

*throws up my hands and stomps off to confusion corner*

Dily: "Hi... My name is Dily. I'm Confused."

Confusion Corner inhabitants: "HI DILY!!!"

"That means time is flowing through the world. The body exacts its toll Susan. Soon my- my former colleagues, bewildered and fleeing, will become tired. They will have to sleep.'

'I follow you, but-'

'I am insane. I know this. But the first time it happened to me I found such horror that I cannot express it. Can you imagine what it is like? For an intellect a billion years old, in a body which is an ape on the back of a rat that grew out of a lizard? Can you imagine what comes out of the dark places, uncontrolled?'

'What are you telling me?'

'They will die in their dreams.' Susan thought about this. Millions and millions of years of thinking precise, logical thoughts - and then humanity's murky past drops all its terrors on you in one go.

Prester Fred wrote:

zachariah wrote:Fish just probably think, I see a bug. I'll go eat it.

Fish aren't capable of thoughts that complex. Their entire vocabulary consists only two words: "Food?" and "Yikes!"

shadowinthelight wrote:

Prester Fred wrote:

zachariah wrote:Fish just probably think, I see a bug. I'll go eat it.

Fish aren't capable of thoughts that complex. Their entire vocabulary consists only two words: "Food?" and "Yikes!"

I've waved my finger in front of enough fish tanks to know they also know "Huh?"

Atomic wrote:
We see fish as swimming. Fish see themselves as flying.

DilyV wrote: 1. Tina is killed in an automobile accident as a result of her demons conspiring with other demons and/or Jin as I understand it...

2. Tina's soul left her body, but couldn't get through the doorway because it was blocked so she was melded with Shelly's demon to become Conscience.

3. As a result of harming their host, Tina's demons were punished by removing their memories.

4. Tina's demons, at the behest of Nudge, reanimate Tina's body and get her up and moving from the morgue. Somehow, they track down Tina's place in Miami and find evidence that she's the daughter of a drug king pin. Somewhere along the line, she settles in Wapsi Square and opens Mucho Mocha.

5. Somewhere along the line, Tina's demons gain a conscience and morals... though they have no memory other than they've been punished.

6. At night, she's an empty shell (do we know where her demons go?)

7. At Dawn, spiders crawl into her eye sockets, she wakes up and the spiders are burned to a crisp as Tina wakes up.

Okay, knowing all the above, We've been shown that Tina sleeps... so wouldn't it stand to reason her demons knows what sleep is? If I'm not mistaken, I can distinctly remember some of her demons trying to wake up another of her demons, to the point of singing "On top of old smokey..." also, hasn't she perceived the cold, seen it snow? So it stands to reason that the demons have experienced things on a more human rather than quantum level. As someone else said, her broken arm for example. Granted there is a part of Tina that experiences or can see Auras... and is capable of reading a person well enough to suggest what they would best have to drink for their morning beverage.

There is a huge discontinuity in Tina's ability to perceive, or things have gone really wonky for her. Or our ability to perceive for that matter.

*throws up my hands and stomps off to confusion corner*

Dily: "Hi... My name is Dily. I'm Confused."

Confusion Corner inhabitants: "HI DILY!!!"

Atomic wrote:

Opus the Poet wrote:Ninja'ed. Doesn't anyone sleep around here? And again with that "stars give light" thing.

It may be that Demons "see" emotions and structures, but not the physical processes we perceive. Thus "Light" would be mysterious to them as would be hearing a smell.

We see fish as swimming. Fish see themselves as flying.

Grantwhy wrote:Then there is the possibility that Atsali has some counterweights at the bottom of the pack

GuySmiley wrote:

Grantwhy wrote:Then there is the possibility that Atsali has some counterweights at the bottom of the pack

When I was in school we used to call those "textbooks". And since everyone had to carry them I think you've got the whole counterweight thing the wrong way around. I distinctly remember falling backwards a few times when I had math and science homework on the same day.

Prester Fred wrote:

zachariah wrote:Fish just probably think, I see a bug. I'll go eat it.

Fish aren't capable of thoughts that complex. Their entire vocabulary consists only two words: "Food?" and "Yikes!"

jwhouk wrote:I'll be the first one to say Pablo sometimes needs to re-read his own archives. But then again, I've wondered if he's got this whole thing plotted out. (Not in Howard Tayler style, but more perhaps in Rich Burlew style.)

Opus the Poet wrote:OK I'm going way out on a limb with this, but perhaps what the demons call "light" is something to do with the intelligence of the hosts? We are constantly calling people "bright" and "dim" based on how smart they are in a situation, having people "see the light" when they figure something out, so maybe there is something that sees by how smart we are and we understand that on a subliminal basis.

I had to go read all the comments since this started just to make sure nobody else made the connection.

DilyV wrote:

jwhouk wrote:I'll be the first one to say Pablo sometimes needs to re-read his own archives. But then again, I've wondered if he's got this whole thing plotted out. (Not in Howard Tayler style, but more perhaps in Rich Burlew style.)

I was making a list of all the things we know about Tina... I suppose that it could be that though she is sleeping, her demons don't perceive it as such... Suffice it to say that a lot of us are eager to see this part of the story unfold. Tina has long been an enigma wrapped in a conundrum.