Wapsi Square Forum

Jacob, you might have less difficulty talking to girls if you actually let them finish a sentence.

Atasli, not everyone is trying to get into your pants. I know how easy it is to jump the gun, but chill.

Both ya'll play nice. Seem like you'd make good friends, if not something more.

Dave wrote:So, I guess what I'm suggesting is that you cut the Jacob character a bit of slack, and see where Paul actually takes him. Maybe he will turn out to be a schlemiel (as you seem to suspect), maybe he'll show unexpected depths, and maybe he'll develop new strength of character as he matures. In any case, it's going to require time for this to develop and for us to learn who he truly is.

I am more than willing to turn around my opinion of him based on subsequent revelations. That said, Young Mr. Jawline has had a full week to show some sort of redeeming characteristic, and has utterly failed. It doesn't make for a promising trend line.

And I would like to make note of a tiny double standard here. I have received calls to shape up or GTFO due to my expressed dislike of the character based on the few strips he's been in so far. Yet nobody seems to blink when people are drawing up wedding plans and naming their theoretical grandchildren, based on the same sample size of strips.

Akeche wrote:Having a stereotypical view of someone is... common. Even those of us who would hope we'd simply look past the color of one's skin, will apply stereotypes somewhat until proven otherwise. It's the same idea in the paranormal world I think. In their world, Siren's are Man-Eater's(hopefully not in the literal sense) and possibly even have a bad rap in stealing away men from their current lover's. Just like for poor Jacob, it's believed that he's going to be a Horny Goat.

If Jacob is indeed the victim of stereotyping, then it is all the more egregious if he participates in the same behavior that he would decry.

Just saying.

Thor wrote: I have received calls to shape up or GTFO due to my expressed dislike of the character based on the few strips he's been in so far.

My comment was simply meant to add my thoughts to the mix, not to castigate you for your opinion. I hope other comments were made in a similar vein. If you inferred a judgmental tone from my views, please accept my apology.

Thor you have nothing to get upset about as you brought this upon yourself. We've all made negative comments about some character, or plot twist, at some point of time. When we do we WILL upset some of the followers of Wapsi in some way or other. What happened is you chose to strongly defend your point to forum members that are not about to listen to reasoned discussion. Waste of time as they will not change their minds for any reason and to keep pushing just makes it worse. Any point can be made here but to then argue about it afterwards to lengths is futile. Make you point and move on. Those open to your point will remember it and you will see it reappear sometime else on the forum. But all this back and forth doesn't really accomplish anything other than increase your posting count.

Key to remember: When replies stop being discussion and become attacks, or other responses strident, just don't reply and ignore them. I once made what I thought was a valid comment about the artwork. Real firestorm because of that. I just ignored them. Next day no one cared.

http://www.egscomics.com/sketchbook.php

Found this today - the above link is (Very Safe For Work)

Seems so appropriate to today's discussion .

as363 wrote:http://www.egscomics.com/sketchbook.php
Found this today - the above link is (Very Safe For Work)
Seems so appropriate to today's discussion .

Perhaps I'm being dense, but I don't see the connection. It's probably so obvious I'll give myself a dope-slap, but could you elucidate?

as363 wrote:http://www.egscomics.com/sketchbook.php

Found this today - the above link is (Very Safe For Work)

Seems so appropriate to today's discussion .

That link will only be good until the next sketch is posted...

The permalink to it: http://www.egscomics.com/sketchbook.php?id=847


Incidentally, I agree with Dr. Otter: please elucidate on what you see as the link with today's comic and discussion...

Sgt. Howard wrote:HARHARHARHARHARHARHARHARHARHARHARHAR!!! ... I guess she's got that 'shyness thing' under reasonable control now... OK, he's a Satyr... as others have noted... and not a young longhorn or anything else.

cue; opening strains "Get by with a little help from my friends"
[...]

Nicely done. Bravo!

Sgt. Howard wrote:(Jacob) (reasonable mid-baritone)

I would have pegged him as a timid tenor...

Sgt. Howard wrote:OK- THAT is out of my system, I can take my meds and I'll be fine

Having read your later comment on the subject of meds, I know this will not apply, and therefore is probably safe to joke about...

If said meds were to help treat a multiple personality disorder, one might say that you wrote that filk with a little help from your friends...



Incidentally, while I "saw" the action with the proper Wapsi Square characters, what I "heard" was the intro to The Wonder Years...

AmriloJim wrote:

Thor wrote: I have received calls to shape up or GTFO due to my expressed dislike of the character based on the few strips he's been in so far.

My comment was simply meant to add my thoughts to the mix, not to castigate you for your opinion. I hope other comments were made in a similar vein. If you inferred a judgmental tone from my views, please accept my apology.

Don't worry. You weren't the one who said: "I don't recall anyone saying you should like him, but he's a part of the story now so - and I'm sorry if this is too blunt - either put up or shut up."

I'm not sure about anyone else, but when someone who is neither mod nor artist tells me to do that, I am more strongly inclined to double-down.

zachariah wrote:Thor you have nothing to get upset about as you brought this upon yourself. We've all made negative comments about some character, or plot twist, at some point of time. When we do we WILL upset some of the followers of Wapsi in some way or other. What happened is you chose to strongly defend your point to forum members that are not about to listen to reasoned discussion. Waste of time as they will not change their minds for any reason and to keep pushing just makes it worse. Any point can be made here but to then argue about it afterwards to lengths is futile. Make you point and move on. Those open to your point will remember it and you will see it reappear sometime else on the forum. But all this back and forth doesn't really accomplish anything other than increase your posting count.

Key to remember: When replies stop being discussion and become attacks, or other responses strident, just don't reply and ignore them. I once made what I thought was a valid comment about the artwork. Real firestorm because of that. I just ignored them. Next day no one cared.

You make valid points, but part of this is legitimate curiosity on my part. I have been told that thinking that Jacob is non-good is bad, but I still have yet to hear why one might think Jacob is non-bad. The closest I've gotten is something on the lines of "Wait and see, because he might be clearly good later". Needless to say, this is not terribly satisfying or convincing.

Sgt. Howard wrote:OK- THAT is out of my system, I can take my meds and I'll be fine

Having read your later comment on the subject of meds, I know this will not apply, and therefore is probably safe to joke about...

If said meds were to help treat a multiple personality disorder, one might say that you wrote that filk with a little help from your friends... )

(Tune: Little Drummer Boy)
Said the schizophrenic to his therapist... "do you hear what I hear?"
"I keep hearing voices, Therapist- do you hear what I hear?"
"The voices, they are angry and they're sad- but some of their ideas aren't half-bad... some of their ideas aren't half bad..."

... there's more, but even I have standards...

MPD- you own five toothbrushes and live by yourself. If you threaten suicide, it is considered a hostage situation. Your answering machine response is continually changing with names and voices you do not recognize. You wrap your own Christmas presents and are always surprised. A good deal of your wardrobe you wouldn't wear on a bet, yet it gets laundered routinely. You have credit cards in your possession that you are not sure you ever applied for.

that's enough for now...



Incidentally, while I "saw" the action with the proper Wapsi Square characters, what I "heard" was the intro to The Wonder Years...[/quote]

Didn't Joe Cocker just recently pass on? He would be pleased by your reference, with his drawn-out, raspy 3/4 time rendition- I worked from the Beatle' SPLHCB cut.

Thor wrote:

zachariah wrote:Thor you have nothing to get upset about as you brought this upon yourself. We've all made negative comments about some character, or plot twist, at some point of time. When we do we WILL upset some of the followers of Wapsi in some way or other. What happened is you chose to strongly defend your point to forum members that are not about to listen to reasoned discussion. Waste of time as they will not change their minds for any reason and to keep pushing just makes it worse. Any point can be made here but to then argue about it afterwards to lengths is futile. Make you point and move on. Those open to your point will remember it and you will see it reappear sometime else on the forum. But all this back and forth doesn't really accomplish anything other than increase your posting count.

Key to remember: When replies stop being discussion and become attacks, or other responses strident, just don't reply and ignore them. I once made what I thought was a valid comment about the artwork. Real firestorm because of that. I just ignored them. Next day no one cared.

You make valid points, but part of this is legitimate curiosity on my part. I have been told that thinking that Jacob is non-good is bad, but I still have yet to hear why one might think Jacob is non-bad. The closest I've gotten is something on the lines of "Wait and see, because he might be clearly good later". Needless to say, this is not terribly satisfying or convincing.

Try these.
1. Typical teen who doesn't want to go along with perceived behavior of his family/peer/species group. Not bad and perfectly understandable.
2. Family doesn't understand and he's tired of explaining. Rather than trying to understand they just decide he is afraid of girls.
3. A lot of the girls he has met expect him to behave as a satyr, probably being satyresses, or would it be Satyrettes, themselves. What he can't stand is they don't do anything to really connect with him. They want him to perform without their putting any effort into the connection beyond the obvious.
4. He wants nothing to do with these types and has, for some reason, lumped all girls into that group.
5. This implies he has greater depths to him than obvious. If he was willing to be a satyr he would not care about the emotional, or mental, aspect of a relationship. So he is an atypical satyr indeed.
6. It is already mentioned that he is studious and intent on his school work so he has ambitions beyond what you would normally expect from a satyr.
7. Anyone at that age who is willing to buck the stereotype that consistently is either: A total whimp/dweeb who is afraid of it but doesn't know how to avoid it except passive/aggressive behavior. Or has depth of character to recognize what he wants and is willing to refuse to conform.
8. Sali is the same type as she refuses to meet the siren stereotype and wants to be liked/loved for herself, not because of her powers.
9. This indicates they have a lot more in common than either of them thinks, or is aware of. If they can get past the surface issues I think they will find this out.

So Jacob is more than he seems. As to how valid this deduction it will take time to determine.

Nicely thought out and expressed, zachariah!

I concur!

zachariah wrote:So Jacob is more than he seems. As to how valid this deduction it will take time to determine.

It's a worthy and credible analysis. However it also can be summed up as "Wait and see, because he might be clearly good later".

To your points above, I would add: "Is being introduced as a probably romantic interest for the new main character, which implies that they are a person that we will want to see more of (though we might not know it yet) or will turn out to be a villain in disguise . . . one of those two extremes with anything in between unlikely." More of a writing-craft argument than a character-behavior argument.

EDIT: Hmm. I would have expected a new strip to have dropped by now...Are we going to have to wait until Friday?

eee wrote:And those square eyebrows are giving me problems...

Eyebrows...

Thor, I do not know you particularly well- and perhaps this format does not show you in your best light- but you do tend to come off as a grumpy old sod from time to time and I suspect THAT is what these fellows are reacting to. I do not intend this as an assault, but perhaps an explanation of the phenomena that I am witnessing. As for the rest of you- WE ARE DISCUSSING A FICTIONAL STORY TOLD IN CARTOON FORMAT!!!- give it the seriousness it truly commands, which is slight. If Thor takes exception to a given character FOR WHATEVER REASON, that is his privilege. If he is doing this to stir a pot, the best solution is to ignore him... but to expand such energy over such a... trivial... matter- I come here to AVOID raising my blood pressure.

That being said, my take on Jacob is simple- he is a mid-teenager, bloody damn awkward, totally uncomfortable with who and what he is... remarkably similar to a LARGE number of human teenagers age 13 to 17, except THEY don't grow horns out of their foreheads when aroused. A classic nerd. And for every nerd, there is a nerdette- they do find each other, and it isn't what WE see in the boy that means diddely squat, it is what SHE sees in the boy.

I am 60 years old. I have a stent in my chest from a heart attack that should have killed me- that was 7 years ago on the 23rd of this month. I have a curvy, sassy redhead here who thinks I am the greatest thing that ever walked upright... she is 21 years my junior, and could have any man in the county if she so desired- but she is devoted to me.

Exactly what see sees in me, I have no friggen' clue- BUT I AM NOT STUPID ENOUGH TO ARGUE THE POINT! She is happy, so I am happy. Everybody else is scratching their heads and WE DON'T CARE.

Atsali sees something we don't. If it is right or wrong, we shall see- right now there is not enough input to tell.

BTW- great story, Paul. You have had fun doing this one...

Thor wrote:Seriously though, "Put up or shut up"? What does that even mean? Love it or leave it? Sorry, no. Not happening. Discussion forums are for the discussion and analyses of a particular topic--in this case Wapsi Square and its constituent parts. And one of those parts is the new guy. And discussion does not mean fawning over him like he's the hottest new flavor or the cock of the walk. It means taking him apart and seeing what makes him tick.

Alright. I'm sorry I said that. It was wrong of me to tell you to stifle your opinion; you have the right to express hate for which ever character you...uh, like, for whatever reason. My actual, poorly-expressed intent was to inform you that not everyone here loves Jacob as much as you seem to think we do. I, for one, have not once fawned over him nor proclaimed him "cock of the walk," and I resented the assertion this was happening.
So I'll take my own advice: From now on, when I read a comment that leaves a bad taste in my mouth, I'll rinse & spit & move on.

Here is a Jacob thought: Maybe he's gone through what Atsali did re: recent Puberty Changes.

Up until now, perhaps he was an introverted studious "I'm fine by myself" loaner but with the recent 'demonstrative expressiveness' going on, he's even more gun shy. maybe.

There may well be some pressure, both internal & familial, that is saying to him to [baritone] "Fulfill Your Destiny".[/baritone]

And of course, Young, Inexperienced Love... (as in, is he The One...)

“Goddamn, I...I gotta tell you, I'm fairly excited to see what you're capable of, if Morpheus is right and all...We're not supposed to talk about this, but if you are...Damn, it's a very exciting time.”

Opus the Poet wrote: Eyebrows...

What the Hell was that about?!?