March 12, 2020 (aka COVID-19 thread)

[TazManiac]

Now that you mention it, back in February, my former coworker and I recalled that we'd both had a slight malaise that passed quickly.

I'm looking for a Antibody test I can qualify for...

https://xkcd.com/2298/ AND
https://xkcd.com/2299/

[Atomic]

A reminder: Woodstock and the Hong Kong Flu - Link

[Atomic]

More numbers

[TazManiac]

Today was the third (and final) Early Monday, and as I am on the West Coast that meant 5am to synchronize w/ the rest of the country.

It also meant 'fun' in getting around because while the job is smack in the downtown metro area, Transit has been steadily curtailing itself, again and again since San Francisco rung the bell on 'Stay At Home'. (I think SF was the first major city to do so...)

My commute, usually, is bike a mile & a half to the Train, then another short mile on the northern end to work. As the accumulated toll of the pandemic, (and our response) has been thousand-cut'ing me, I've taken to making use of the feeder bus to get me on the train in the AM.

A few times it's been pretty disheartening to get passed up by the early morning 'Night Owl' service because while the bus is not full, there is not more room, due to physical spacing rules.

I know they have their rules to abide by, and a lot of the late night occupants are Homeless with no other good options, but (and I'm sorry L.W.) I one time gave the finger to a driver as he passed up my stop, and I was pretty mad too- until I figured it out.

The transit agency has adapted by running a full-on articulated 'stretch' bus in tandem w/ a 'regular' companion bus to handle the overflow during the graveyard shift.

Keep in mind this is the only thing running at the odd hours and by the time you get on at one end of the route and are deposited in Downtown San Fran you've traveled about 35, very slow, miles.

I certainly miss the Baby-Bullet Express Train schedule...

[AnotherFairportfan]

I think Seattle was the first city to do it.

[lake_wrangler]

I know they have their rules to abide by, and a lot of the late night occupants are Homeless with no other good options, but (and I'm sorry L.W.) I one time gave the finger to a driver as he passed up my stop, and I was pretty mad too- until I figured it out.

WELL. I. NEVER...

[Warrl]

I know they have their rules to abide by, and a lot of the late night occupants are Homeless with no other good options, but (and I'm sorry L.W.) I one time gave the finger to a driver as he passed up my stop, and I was pretty mad too- until I figured it out.

WELL. I. NEVER...

Really? From the looks of you, I think maybe you should...

[lake_wrangler]

I know they have their rules to abide by, and a lot of the late night occupants are Homeless with no other good options, but (and I'm sorry L.W.) I one time gave the finger to a driver as he passed up my stop, and I was pretty mad too- until I figured it out.

WELL. I. NEVER...

Really? From the looks of you, I think maybe you should...

I should give myself the finger, as I pass a bus stop without stopping?

I'm all confuzled...

[lake_wrangler]

Well, we're slowly unlocking the province of Québec... Some schools will reopen soon, although there are still questions about how to maintain social distancing in the classrooms, though. But schools in Montréal will take longer to open up. Same with some businesses...

But larger businesses, which have a door to the outside (i.e. not in a closed-in mall) will be allowed to open.

They're also opening up some of the police roadblocks which had been set in place a while back, to prevent non-essential traveling between the various regions of the province.


This week, and part of last, there has been an increase in the number of vehicles on the road, although the number of passengers on the busses has remained fairly stable (read: low, compared to the usual). Seeing how people have been driving, during the last week, I can't help but wonder if many people have forgotten how to drive, during the lockdown... (Odd: my browser does not seem to recognize the word "lockdown"...)

[Sgt. Howard]

I have been avoiding this thread due to the fact that my politics (and this has devolved into PURE politics) offend so many people here- it is very likely that this is the post that will get me booted from WAPSI completely... but this needs to be pointed out...

HR 748, the Coronavirus Aid, Relief and Economic Security act ("CARES act") that was signed by President Trump on March 27, 2020, was initially brought to the house floor on January 24, 2019- a FULL YEAR AND THREE WEEKS before the disease was named COVID19!!! Introduced by Connecticut 2and district representative Joe Courtney (democrat), in went through the whole process and was awaiting signature by July of 2019! THIS BILL WAS IN THE WINGS BEFORE ANYBODY EVEN HEARD OF COVID10!! Go to Congress.gov and check it out for yourself!!!

[Dave]

I have been avoiding this thread due to the fact that my politics (and this has devolved into PURE politics) offend so many people here- it is very likely that this is the post that will get me booted from WAPSI completely... but this needs to be pointed out...

HR 748, the Coronavirus Aid, Relief and Economic Security act ("CARES act") that was signed by President Trump on March 27, 2020, was initially brought to the house floor on January 24, 2019- a FULL YEAR AND THREE WEEKS before the disease was named COVID19!!! Introduced by Connecticut 2and district representative Joe Courtney (democrat), in went through the whole process and was awaiting signature by July of 2019! THIS BILL WAS IN THE WINGS BEFORE ANYBODY EVEN HEARD OF COVID10!! Go to Congress.gov and check it out for yourself!!!

I did check it out for myself. To paraphrase Inigo Montoya, "I don't think that record means what you think it means."

As best as I can tell from what I see on the Congressional Record, what you're saying isn't correct (or, at least, it's a very misleading statement). There seem to be two very different bills involved... or, rather, one bill which was completely "gutted" and replaced.

In the record you point to, it appears that the first "HR 748" bill was from the 115th session of Congress, which ran from January 2017 through January 2019. The Congressional record reads "Middle Class Health Benefits Tax Repeal Act of 2019: H.R. 748, amended, to amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to repeal the excise tax on high cost employer-sponsored health coverage, by a 2⁄3 yea-and-nay vote of 419 yeas to 6 nays, Roll No. 493." It was basically an adjustment to one of the provisions of Obamacare. Although it's health-related, it had nothing directly to do with COVID-19 (or any other specific virus).

This bill passed the House (as noted above), was sent to the Senate for consideration, was read twice, and was put on the calendar. No further action seems to have been taken at that time... it just sat there for months. As far as I can tell, the Senate didn't vote on it, didn't pass it, and it was never sent to the President for signing.

The text of the second HR 748 wasn't introduced until March of this year... this is the CARES Act as we know it.

It looks to me as if when the Senate started considering the CARES Act, they used a bit of legislative "trickery" to process it quickly. Rather than introduce a new bill (and have to go through the rules processes required to get it prioritized and considered) they chose to amend a bill which was already "before the Senate". In effect they "gutted" the Senate version of the original HR 748, and replaced it with the CARES Act provisions. This would let them consider it "on the floor" almost immediately. Also, after it was passed, they could send it back to the House for "reconciliation" - basically, asking the House to accept their amendment of the original HR 748. That, also, is a quicker process than asking the House to consider a new bill (which requires that a Representative formally introduce the new bill for consideration).

This is a common legislative practice (both Federally and in many states). It has both good and bad aspects.

So, to sum it up:

• The original HR 748 was a minor amendment to Obamacare - eliminating one excise tax on higher-priced "premium" health plans. It had nothing at all to do with COVID-19 or with pandemics.
• This bill was passed by the House in July 2019. It was sent to the Senate at that time. The Senate read it, and scheduled it for debate and a vote, but never actually voted on it.
• In March of 2020, the Senate pulled this bill off the shelf, amended it (removed the original legislation, completely replaced it with the new "CARES Act" language), voted, passed it, and sent the "amendment" back to the House.
• The House accepted the "amendment" and sent the completely-amended bill to the President for signing.

I see no evidence in the Congressional Record of HR 748 that either the House or the Senate was considering COVID-19 (by that name or any other), or preparation for any pandemic virus, in 2019.

[Sgt. Howard]

Thank you- I was completely flabberghasted by the implications of what I had found.

[TazManiac]

(you gotta try much harder to get kicked of'a Wapsi...)

[Atomic]

Keep in mind that "Coronavirus" is a class of virus, similar to Staphylococcus is one type of microbial infection of many, and has many variations. When you say Influenza, think how many versions you've heard of in the past many years? It's like that.

The detailed scientific medical name is exact, the generalized name is less so, and the common name covers a lot of ground. The virus is that came forth from Whuan, China, was identified as a Coronavirus (family name), and labeled as COVID-19 for COronaVirus, Infectious Disease, 2019 for formal classification purposes regarding health and treatment records. It's super science Latin name might be Roundus Pokie-pokie Diediedie for all I know, but very few people would be using that term unless they need to distinguish it from Roundus Pokie-pokie Gigglesnortfart, which is similar but acts very differently.

[AnotherFairportfan]

Malaria drug touted by Trump for coronavirus fails another test
By Gene Emery / Reuters

The malaria treatment repeatedly championed by U.S. President Donald Trump as a "game changer" in the fight against the novel coronavirus has again failed to show a benefit in patients hospitalized with COVID-19, according to a study released on Thursday.

While the study being published in the New England Journal of Medicine had certain limitations, doctors reported that the use of hydroxycholoquine neither lessened the need for patients requiring breathing assistance nor the risk of death.

"We didn't see any association between getting this medicine and the chance of dying or being intubated," lead researcher Dr. Neil Schluger told Reuters in a telephone interview. "The patients who got the drug didn't seem to do any better."

Among patients given hydroxychloroquine, 32.3% ended up needing a ventilator or dying, compared with 14.9% of patients who were not given the drug.

But doctors were more likely to give hydroxychloroquine to sicker patients, so researchers at New York-Presbyterian Hospital and Columbia University Irving Medical Center adjusted the rates to account for that. They concluded that the drug may not have hurt patients, but it clearly did not help.

Decades old hydroxychloroquine, which is also used to treat lupus and rheumatoid arthritis, also showed no benefit when combined with the antibiotic azithromycin, Schluger's team reported. Azithromycin alone also showed no benefit.

Last month, doctors at the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs reported that hydroxychloroquine did not help COVID-19 patients and might pose a higher risk of death.

That analysis of medical records showed a death rate of 28% when the drug was given in addition to standard treatments, compared to 11% with standard care alone.

In the latest study, 811 patients got hydroxychloroquine and 565 did not.

Because they were not randomly assigned to receive hydroxychloroquine or a placebo, "the study should not be taken to rule out either benefit or harm" for the drug, researchers said. Randomized trials, the gold standard for tests of new therapies, should continue, they added.

But for now, "the guidance in our hospital has changed so we don't recommend giving hydroxychloroquine to hospitalized patients," said Dr. Schluger, chief of the division of pulmonary, allergy and critical care medicine at Irving.

Smaller studies, including one done in China, had suggested hydroxychloroquine might be useful, "but these were tiny studies and not of good quality. People seized on them because patients were dying," he said.

There are currently no approved treatments for COVID-19, although Gilead Sciences Inc's experimental antiviral drug remdesivir last week received emergency use authorization from U.S. regulators.

[AnotherFairportfan]

The Google News page that searching on that headline led to.

[Atomic]

More good news.

TL;DR:

Florida, DeSantis said again and again, was being guided by “facts, data and science.” His many critics disagree, accusing him of playing to Trump in handling the crisis. But if you take even a cursory look at Florida’s numbers, they tend to bear him out. DeSantis is right about how the virus treats the young differently from the old. In Florida, people 65 and older account for 26% of all cases but 83% of the deaths. People younger than 55 account for only 7% of the death toll.

[jwhouk]

So. For those of you who think we should be opening things up and loosening restrictions: they said something similar 40 years ago.

[lake_wrangler]

One thing that amused me, was seeing the sports channel on the TV at work (I don't watch TV at home, let alone sports - I'm really not into sports...) replaying hockey matches from 2014...

[lake_wrangler]

Other sights also amuse me:

People walking around with a mask on... below their nose...
(I even had a passenger, yesterday, come in the bus with a mask on, with a hole in the mask just below the nose, to facilitate breathing! )
People, alone in their car, driving with the windows closed and wearing a mask...

Less amusing, and more annoying:

Shortly after the lockdown and social distancing started, our workplace started putting stickers in place, reminding us to keep 2 meters apart from each other... but this week, a full two months after everything started, they started making part of the corridor into a one-way passage...

Last week, or perhaps two weeks ago, they used yellow ("danger") tape to block every second urinal and every second faucet on the 5-faucet sink in the bathroom...