More Stuff

[Alkarii]

A big part of the problem is that it has to snow for a while to start sticking (as in, not melt on contact with the road). Until that time, all the snow that had melted or turned to slush by people driving on it refreezes, then gets buried under snow, if the snow lasts that long. My first time driving on snow (followed soon after by driving on ice for the first time), I had no problem, because my parents had told me a lot about driving on snow and ice. Accelerate slow, limit your speed, and brake slow and early.

But when you have the uneven melting, thanks to all the trees shading the road and the packed snow/ice, that gets to be a pain. About like driving on a heavily rutted and muddy road, depending on the amount of accumulation.

[AnotherFairportfan]

Yeah. Doesn't help Y'all use brine on your streets.

You talkin' to me?

No - we don't.

[AnotherFairportfan]

A big part of the problem is that it has to snow for a while to start sticking (as in, not melt on contact with the road). Until that time, all the snow that had melted or turned to slush by people driving on it refreezes, then gets buried under snow, if the snow lasts that long. My first time driving on snow (followed soon after by driving on ice for the first time), I had no problem, because my parents had told me a lot about driving on snow and ice. Accelerate slow, limit your speed, and brake slow and early.

But when you have the uneven melting, thanks to all the trees shading the road and the packed snow/ice, that gets to be a pain. About like driving on a heavily rutted and muddy road, depending on the amount of accumulation.

Yep.

[GlytchMeister]

Well thar’s yer problem. If he’s from Wisconsin, he shoulda known to check for that.

We have stupid drivers too. Not saying we don’t, and not saying southern drivers are especially stupid. They just have less practice and experience. So most everyone down south treats driving in an inch of snow in much the same way a 15-16 year old learner would treat it.

Regarding the other stuff - see, all it really takes is proper training and taking precautions. Like checking for and anticipating ice, doing controlled grip tests, and just being careful.

I can drive on ice. I hate it, it’s really slow going, it’s really tense, and I need a nap afterwards, but I can do it. Snow is much easier.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

I remember the huge ice storms that hit the Dallas area in February 2012. Whole metroplex was shut down for about two weeks.

The problem was that it was just ice, no snow, no sleet, no mixed precipitation... it was freezing rain that stuck everywhere, then a freezing fog to coat everything.

In the morning, I stepped out the door, and the huge oak was a rainbow tree, every single limb, branch, and twig was coated in a sheen of ice, which was doing the whole prism thing it was so clear. Then I tried to open the door and found I couldn't reach my handle, it had been completely encased. As had my tires, up to the hubcaps. Then I realized that I wasn't looking at pavement, there was at least an inch or two of clear ice on top of it. That's... when I went right the hell back inside and called my boss, who flat out told me 'look, whatever you are about to say, let me make this fast. Don't come in. We aren't going to be open. We don't want you risking your neck out there.'

Then the sun came out, and things started to melt... then it re-froze overnight.

There's a stretch of I-20, just east of I-35E, where it banks left and climbs up steep, probably about max gradient permitted for an interstate. Newsies caught a salt/sand truck trying to go up it... and failing. And urging everyone to stay the hell home, because if the sand trucks weren't making it, you sure as hell can't.

Then the next ice storm came through. Then after a few days, the next one. It was almost March before the roads became anything resembling normal again.

[Hansontoons]

Years back, I was driving between Houston and College Station after an ice storm had coated Highway 6. Enough traffic was on the road to have rutted the right lane so we had contact with the road, more or less. The left lane was still covered. We are crawling along and a Honda Civic passes on the left, doing at least 30mph. Followed almost immediately by a large Cadillac.

I was expecting to pass them later, with the Caddy wearing the Honda as a new hood ornament. Never did see them, must have wised up and cut back in line. I was driving a 1969 Ford LTD station wagon, the popular medium-green color with the fancy wood grain sticker siding (with the look of real wood!). Had four others riding with me so had reasonable traction.

[Dave]

Yeah. Doesn't help Y'all use brine on your streets.

You talkin' to me?

No - we don't.

Moncks Corner, SC did try it experimentally, once, on one particular street. Apparently it didn't work out well, and they decided that snow time ain't no time to stay outdoors.

Here in California, some counties have apparently started using brine (this was news to me). The article from CalTrans claims that it produces good results if it's applied to roads before they freeze... it helps prevent ice from forming in the first place, so they spray it as a preventive measure. Used this way they claim lower cost, and only about a fourth as much salt is released into the environment.

Seems like this might be a good solution (NPI) in areas where the biggest problem is "black ice" on cold road surfaces, and maybe not as useful for areas with substantial amount of snow buildup.

Unfortunately this can't address the limitations of California drivers who simply have no experience with driving on snow or ice (most of us). I'm sure we lowlanders provide the locals in e.g. Tahoe with a great deal of amusement every ski season. My own snow-driving reflexes (from my youth in Philadelphia and Rochester NY) have surely atrophied over the decades.

[Alkarii]

Heh, looks like I'm going to have another easy (and a little bit boring) night tonight.

Because the plant was closed for the holiday, all the machines were down, with only the components side running the day after Christmas. I had been doing overtime that night, and they had began the task of starting up the machines in the toilet seat building.

Only one of my machines was running, and it had JUST started producing good product when I came in yesterday, but the other machine was having technical issues, and they STILL haven't gotten it running. At around 1 in the morning, they had to shut down the one I had (which is configured to make shower seats at the moment, making one every five minutes) because nobody could find more boxes for me to use, so I had to take over at another pair of machines because that operator was leaving at 2.

Those machines had a robot building the seats, so for the most part it was pretty easy, except when the shrink wrapper jammed... Then the robots stopped because of a data connection failure, and the guy who came to fix it had to call for backup.

Weirdly, I wasn't really frustrated, and I got a chuckle or two out of it.

[Warrl]

Y’know... I bet there’s a seasonal business opportunity there.

Yankee drivers go south for winter, drive people through the relatively benign weather of the southern winter, then go back north.

Or maybe just stay and be Uber or Taxi Drivers or something with a “Can Drive In Snow” distinction.

The only time my car got hit (not too badly) by someone who lost control in the snow in Atlanta, the guy was from Wisconsin.

He said he'd always laughed at those videos on the news of Southern drivers having all kinds of trouble in an inch or less of snow.

What he hadn't realised, he said, was that under that inch of snow was a quarter-inch of ice.

Also, snow and ice behave MUCH differently at 30 degrees than at zero degrees.

[jwhouk]

Just ask any ice skater.

[Catawampus]

Years ago I had to drive a tractor trailer rig hauling a transformer across the Alps in the middle of Winter. I had a very shiny new lieutenant as company. He felt that, being the officer, he was the one who ought to read the map and decide on the route and that I, a lowly enlisted person, ought not be allowed to even see the map. The result being that we ended up in the middle of the night trying to go up a very steep grade on a very narrow winding road with a sheer rock face on one side and a long drop on the other. . .and the road covered in a layer of ice about a fist thick.

We got to the point where the truck just couldn't advance any further up. Trying to back down wasn't working, either, because it would just slide around uncontrollably. I ended up sending the lieutenant off on foot "to get help" (AKA "to quit bothering me and getting in the way"), then took a tire iron and chipped clear paths through the ice for the wheels on both sides of the truck, down about a hundred meters to where the ice started. Good fun.

In the morning, I stepped out the door, and the huge oak was a rainbow tree, every single limb, branch, and twig was coated in a sheen of ice, which was doing the whole prism thing it was so clear.

That happens a lot here on the upper slopes. Trees, fences, individual blades of grass will all have a sparkly coating of ice. Nice to look at, but I'd hate to be out without any sunglasses.

Here in California, some counties have apparently started using brine (this was news to me).

Apparently beet juice is a new thing that some places are trying. Less problems with corrosion and soil contamination, but you get lots of purple cars.

[Typeminer]

They use some kind of brine on the PA Turnpike, at least on the western sections through the mountains. It gets thrown into the air by traffic and coats your windshield, at least if you're driving a Corolla/Civic-size car. So, if it's cold enough that your wipers are stiff, or your washer nozzles freeze up, or your washer fluid freezes on contact with the windshield, you can't see. [Cue Zappa: Nanook of the North]

One time, I had to pull off and pelt the windshield with snowballs.

Loads of fun.

[Warrl]

Apparently beet juice is a new thing that some places are trying. Less problems with corrosion and soil contamination, but you get lots of purple cars.

And if you commit murder on the sidewalk, you need to dispose of the body but don't bother cleaning up the blood.

[Atomic]

Ah, yes, the salty road brine -- 10 miles and Every car is a white car!

[GlytchMeister]

Ah, yes, the salty road brine -- 10 miles and Every car is a white car!

It’s even worse at the manufacturing plant I work at. They used so much salt the roads are caked with it. There’s actually less grip than on plain asphalt. Driving fast raises a cloud of salt. It’s like driving on a salt flat. And if it’s only a little damp, it gets flung up on my truck’s windshield... and it does not have a window washing fluid sprayer.

[Alkarii]

After checking the weather again today, it seems that the precipitation that was expected for this area yesterday decided to postpone it's arrival until next Sunday. Hopefully it decides to delay again, because I have to work that night.

EDIT: Never mind, I checked it again after posting, and it turns out the expected temperature for that day is high enough that ice/sleet/snow shouldn't be an issue.

[jwhouk]

The wind chill, however...

[Alkarii]

I'm not worried about windchill, as I'm inside except when I'm going to or from my car. The machines at work generate enough heat that I'll sweat on occasion.

[AnotherFairportfan]

Down to 14F here in North Georgia.

[Alkarii]

Wow, that made me check the temperature for this area. Turns out it's one degree colder here. I was expecting it to be a little higher, actually.