Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

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lake_wrangler
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by lake_wrangler »

Sgt. Howard wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 10:39 am"It rendered the tea undrinkable, even by American standards,"
I know I've heard this before, and I'm pretty sure it came from a movie, but I can't seem to place it.

Could you refresh my memory?
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by Dave »

Opus the Poet wrote: Tue May 12, 2020 2:58 am Now we know why there haven't been new comic posts for a while, animation is like a week's worth of comic drawings for a few seconds of video time. At 24 frames per second for full animation that's 6 days of Wapsi comics per second of video.
Yeah. Economically, hand-drawn animation is a bit of a hard cel.
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

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Opus the Poet wrote: Tue May 12, 2020 2:58 am Now we know why there haven't been new comic posts for a while, animation is like a week's worth of comic drawings for a few seconds of video time. At 24 frames per second for full animation that's 6 days of Wapsi comics per second of video.
Actually, even Disney classical animation is only twelve images per second; each one is shot twice.

The term for this is "on twos".

Roger Rabbit was only the second Disney release shot on the ones; the only one before that was "The Old Mill"
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

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Even then, Isn't there some 'in-between-r" automation going on?
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

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This is where Hanna-Barberra make their mint - they looked at animation as a process and came up with the floating character on a looping background. Similarly, freeze bodies and moving heads. That's why most every H-B character had a collar or scarf to allow for head positioning without sweating the lineup too much. Ditto arms/legs in walking/running sequences. Since 3/4 of the frame was static or stepped background, the work load was reduced big time.
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by Alkarii »

So that's why those older cartoon characters wouldn't move most of their bodies.
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

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Even then, Isn't there some 'in-between-r" automation going on?

In other words, it doesn't look like he's penning every frame.
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by TazManiac »

Alkarii wrote: Wed May 13, 2020 1:33 am So that's why those older cartoon characters wouldn't move most of their bodies.
Having watched great deal of after school programming, I'd puzzled out things like that.

(I'm one of those annoying Under-Achieving Phenoms you've heard so much about...)

There is another related class where the whole head is static and only the mouth area is animated.
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by lake_wrangler »

I remember watching a cartoon, once, where the characters (from a series with decent animation value) ended up in the world of another cartoon (I think it was Fat Albert) with somewhat lower animation value/quality. At one point, the Fat Albert characters could not go on, because they had run out of animation budget for the episode, or something to that effect (ran out of # of allowable animation frames per episode, or something like that), because the higher animation value characters had used them all up.

I wish I could remember what that cartoon was.
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by Sgt. Howard »

lake_wrangler wrote: Tue May 12, 2020 10:14 am
Sgt. Howard wrote: Fri May 08, 2020 10:39 am"It rendered the tea undrinkable, even by American standards,"
I know I've heard this before, and I'm pretty sure it came from a movie, but I can't seem to place it.

Could you refresh my memory?
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by AnotherFairportfan »

TazManiac wrote: Tue May 12, 2020 5:14 pm Even then, Isn't there some 'in-between-r" automation going on?
In Disney animation {and Looney Tunes, too, i think} the lead animator does "key frames" beginning and ending a sequence, and the "in-betweeners" fill in the frames in between - at twelve frames per second, and then each is shot twice.

{If the action is particularly fast, the animation will sometimes switch fro twos to shooting on ones, to avoid "strobing", when something moves too far from frame to frame.}
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by AnotherFairportfan »

Atomic wrote: Tue May 12, 2020 8:59 pm This is where Hanna-Barberra make their mint - they looked at animation as a process and came up with the floating character on a looping background. Similarly, freeze bodies and moving heads. That's why most every H-B character had a collar or scarf to allow for head positioning without sweating the lineup too much. Ditto arms/legs in walking/running sequences. Since 3/4 of the frame was static or stepped background, the work load was reduced big time.
Another thing you might not have noticed on HB animation - only the character who is talking is actually moving in most cases.

Disney and other houses doing full animation, shooting on twos had a trick where half of the moving elements in a shot would be shot on alternate frames - one would be photographed on frames AB,CD and the other half would be shot BC,DE - so that every frame projected would have something moving in it...
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by Atomic »

As pointed out, animating "on the twos" makes the imagery 12FPS in a 24FPS environment, which can cause strobing. IIRC, the animators of Jurassic Park dealt with something similar to get their animated dinos moving realistically. One of the advances in their animation package was introducing a level of speed blur to the movement, making it more "film like" by emulating the frame exposure capture rate.
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Re: Announcing the voice actors for upcoming Wapsi Square short 2020-05-02

Post by Opus the Poet »

TazManiac wrote: Wed May 13, 2020 8:34 am
Alkarii wrote: Wed May 13, 2020 1:33 am So that's why those older cartoon characters wouldn't move most of their bodies.
Having watched great deal of after school programming, I'd puzzled out things like that.

(I'm one of those annoying Under-Achieving Phenoms you've heard so much about...)

There is another related class where the whole head is static and only the mouth area is animated.
People talking without moving their chins was one of my peeves with H-B "animation".
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