Nothing Serious 2012-10-08

[Nimrod]

1. Shelly now remembers everything that happened in the time forest, while the others only remember that last loop of the calendar--so she can't help but be a little condescending.

Speaking that absolutely I would say that what Shelly 2 remembers is everything that happened in the time forest from the first reset point of the calendar machine and was excluded from loops and the world so she would/should only know all those millions of years of solitude in the forest outside of the loops so would not be all that more knowledgeable than anyone else - just more seasoned. This is still a tiny bit or retcon because if Shelly 1 was actually the resilient ageless Sphinx then the super radioactive artifact would not have killed her thus "allowing" Shelly 2 to enter the real world -or- Shelly 2 (Sphinx Shelly) is not part of the same line that is Shelly 1 who was just an expendable duplicate and not really a character to care about as Shelly 2 existed concurrently in the time forest ready to take her place. Either way, Shelly 1 and Shelly 2 are two different entities and NOT THE SAME CHARACTER. So - Shelly 2 is a condescending in this regard.

2. We are starting to see how Monica poited out of the way of bullets, etc.

As has been explained before and well covered in previous forums and in the strip comments the consensus is that Monica did not Poit out of the way or Poit the bullets but rather acted as a door to them. She lacked the knowledge, ability, skill and experience to accomplish that manner of Poit but was acting as a door at that very time and the bullets simply went through her cloths and into the nether regions. (The suggestion that she reflexively or unconsciously did a Poit on all the bullets was put forward and that is fine, however that still means she had no control and can not be given credit for actually doing it - like giving credit for someone sneezing)

3. The "spike" in her head isn't really in her actual head...but it is "somewhere" or more likely "some when".

Almost right, as the nether regions appear to work at a different time scale (Look at Jin's mother, Bud's clothing, etc.) - But you are right in saying that the spike is not actually in her head. I would go so far as to say that the physics appear to imply that the blade is gone - again because of the doorway thing.

4. We have Shelly's back story and how she came to be, why she is sphinx, etc. Now it is time to find out just who Monica is and where she came from. Things just keep getting curiouser and curiouser .

Shelly 2's back story (aka the shower scene of the Wapsi universe) is fine - If we do spend some more story time on Monica that would be nice. In fact any other character would be fine... Dietzel time however would be great!

[lake_wrangler]

Carpe diem.

Is that a fish per day?

[drops a fishing net into the pun jar]
(Actually, I know that means "Seize the day.")

What? You want us to refrain from using lubricating oil to keep the day moving properly?

Drops a few drops from an old bottle of 3-in-1 oil on the pun jar's hinges

[Dave]

2. We are starting to see how Monica poited out of the way of bullets, etc.

As has been explained before and well covered in previous forums and in the strip comments the consensus is that Monica did not Poit out of the way or Poit the bullets but rather acted as a door to them. She lacked the knowledge, ability, skill and experience to accomplish that manner of Poit but was acting as a door at that very time and the bullets simply went through her cloths and into the nether regions. (The suggestion that she reflexively or unconsciously did a Poit on all the bullets was put forward and that is fine, however that still means she had no control and can not be given credit for actually doing it - like giving credit for someone sneezing)

Nimrod, if you're claiming that "reflexive poiting" or "unconscious poiting" isn't really poiting, but is instead "acting as a door"... well, that's something that I've never heard anyone else ever assert (nobody out here in forum-land, that is, and none of the Wapsi characters either).

WIthin the strip Monica's own words were "Some kind of instinctual-self-preservation-poiting of the bullets, just before they perforated my skin, or caused them to graze somehow" and Shelly immediately agreed that both she and Bud had come to the same conclusion. (Edit: see this strip and a couple of days on either side.) No one of these characters referred to what Monica had done, as "creating a doorway for the bullets" or anything like that, as far as I can tell.

As to why "Monica can not be given credit for doing it... like someone sneezing" - I don't see why not! The effects of a sneeze are quite real and physical, even if it's not a conscious action. Monica's instinctual poiting of the bullets was equally real and physical (within the strip, of course), and it saved her life... any mundane human Wapsi person in the same situation would have been killed. It appears to be as much a part of her poiting power, as her conscious poits (which don't always work as she might have desired )

So, I have to disagree with you on this point - I think you're claiming a distinction that isn't supported by the strip continuity.

[Fairportfan]

scoff scoff

Kinda hard to tell just who you're scoffing at, FF, since you didn't quote and since today's comments are ranging all over the map.

Fixed. I thought it was going to wind up directly under the post in question.

[Fairportfan]

stuff - most of it wrong

scoff scoff

[NebulousRikulau]

Tithonus was granted eternal life but not eternal youth.

Monica's body is plainly not self-maintaining its youth, not even after the Calendar ritual. So yes, I think she is in direct danger of suffering a fate like Tithonus.

Thinking about it, Monica has been told that she won't let herself be harmed 'too seriously'.
This might mean that if she's stupid she could trip and break a leg, but she wouldn't break her neck.
When paying attention she wouldn't even stub her toe.

Aging isn't harm in and of itself, but the effects of aging can be harmful.
Monica hasn't been trying to stay in shape, thus the 'sagging' and the need for Industrial Strength Lingerie.

"You're only as old as you feel"

Perhaps as long as Monica pays attention and stays in shape, she won't really age.
And she may firm up a bit, too.

But a lengthy bout of depression could send her to her 'real' age.

[Bathorys Daughter]

1. Shelly now remembers everything that happened in the time forest, while the others only remember that last loop of the calendar--so she can't help but be a little condescending.

Speaking that absolutely I would say that what Shelly 2 remembers is everything that happened in the time forest from the first reset point of the calendar machine and was excluded from loops and the world so she would/should only know all those millions of years of solitude in the forest outside of the loops so would not be all that more knowledgeable than anyone else - just more seasoned. This is still a tiny bit or retcon because if Shelly 1 was actually the resilient ageless Sphinx then the super radioactive artifact would not have killed her thus "allowing" Shelly 2 to enter the real world -or- Shelly 2 (Sphinx Shelly) is not part of the same line that is Shelly 1 who was just an expendable duplicate and not really a character to care about as Shelly 2 existed concurrently in the time forest ready to take her place. Either way, Shelly 1 and Shelly 2 are two different entities and NOT THE SAME CHARACTER. So - Shelly 2 is a condescending in this regard.

Not quite. It was Shelly 57 who went to and returned from, the Time Tree Forest (TTF). In one sense, Shelly 57 was effectively hurtled 80,000+ years into the past when she was transported by the artifact, ending up in the TTF. But the TTF was actually going backwards in time, so what really happened is that she intersected with the TTF 80,000-some-odd years offset from the time flow she left. As time passed for Shelly 57, she met Shelly 56, Shelly 55, etc. This is because each of them was, likewise, hurtled into the past (intersected with the TTF), just like Shelly 57, but one cycle time difference (1450 years). For Shelly 57, this was 1450 years after she got there for Shelly 56 to arrive, 2900 years for Shelly 55, etc. And so it went, until Shelly 1 arrived. She then used Shelly 1's artifact to go home. Shelly 57 was the same Shelly we have known since the beginning of the series and, as far as we know, the only Shelly to turn into an ageless sphinx. There may have been others, but it's not clear. This may be the first time Bia used a Titan and true sphinx to make Shellinx. From what Bia said, she may have tried before but it never quite worked out.

[Mark N]

Not quite. It was Shelly 57 who went to and returned from, the Time Tree Forest (TTF). In one sense, Shelly 57 was effectively hurtled 80,000+ years into the past when she was transported by the artifact, ending up in the TTF. But the TTF was actually going backwards in time, so what really happened is that she intersected with the TTF 80,000-some-odd years offset from the time flow she left. As time passed for Shelly 57, she met Shelly 56, Shelly 55, etc. This is because each of them was, likewise, hurtled into the past (intersected with the TTF), just like Shelly 57, but one cycle time difference (1450 years). For Shelly 57, this was 1450 years after she got there for Shelly 56 to arrive, 2900 years for Shelly 55, etc. And so it went, until Shelly 1 arrived. She then used Shelly 1's artifact to go home. Shelly 57 was the same Shelly we have known since the beginning of the series and, as far as we know, the only Shelly to turn into an ageless sphinx. There may have been others, but it's not clear. This may be the first time Bia used a Titan and true sphinx to make Shellinx. From what Bia said, she may have tried before but it never quite worked out.

I would say you got it all correct except that Paul has confirmed that all of the other "Shelly's" were different people none of whom had Titan or Sphinx heritage. Some even had different names. The only similarity for them was Cherokee heritage. In effect, Shelly was always a Sphinx. That is why she only had a headache when the bowling ball fell on her head instead of a contusion or other brain damage. The Time Forest just gave her the physical time to shrug off her human preconceptions about her true nature. (Also, thanks for getting to that before I did.)

[Yamara]

Thinking about it, Monica has been told that she won't let herself be harmed 'too seriously'.
This might mean that if she's stupid she could trip and break a leg, but she wouldn't break her neck.
When paying attention she wouldn't even stub her toe.

Or... bees can sneak up and sting her, and even when paying attention she can smack herself in the head with a pistol.

Aging isn't harm in and of itself, but the effects of aging can be harmful.

Senescence has a number of contributing causes, and the failure to mitigate them inevitably results in physical death, the ultimate and final harm. The very fact of youth (life 'springing up from seed') means mitigation is demonstrably possible, even in a form as complex as human. However, if exercise alone could do it, we'd all be working out toward eternal youth: Since youth isn't happening in Monica via magic, she is facing senescence without the release of death, a horror best framed by withering shells of Tithonus and the Cumaean Sibyl.

To us they're just mythology, but to Monica they're case studies in her slice-of-undeath hospital drama.

I imagine her condition will be enough to even freak out the vampires.

[nerf-dweller]

You know, I'm glad we're learning where M's self-preservation-poit comes from...

Ah, but are we yet? Monica's "exploding islands" self-preservation poits might be attributed to the spike in her head, but IIRC her first demonstration of this power was her poiting away of the bullets being fired at her... and this occurred well before Shelly spiked her during the CM shutdown.

So, either the key-spike was operating very early (before "installation") and when not even in Monica's possession, or it's acausal, or Monica's own poiting powers were able to act without the spike's assistance/control.

No. Monica's self-preservation poiting abilities have been present long before the exploding islands. Recall that Monica retrieved the Teleport Cloth in a hail of bullets before the Calendar was fixed.

[Dave]

You know, I'm glad we're learning where M's self-preservation-poit comes from...

Ah, but are we yet? Monica's "exploding islands" self-preservation poits might be attributed to the spike in her head, but IIRC her first demonstration of this power was her poiting away of the bullets being fired at her... and this occurred well before Shelly spiked her during the CM shutdown.

So, either the key-spike was operating very early (before "installation") and when not even in Monica's possession, or it's acausal, or Monica's own poiting powers were able to act without the spike's assistance/control.

No. Monica's self-preservation poiting abilities have been present long before the exploding islands. Recall that Monica retrieved the Teleport Cloth in a hail of bullets before the Calendar was fixed.

Ummm... I think that's exactly what I said?

[Prester Fred]

I would say that Euryale was probably not in on any manipulation. Her concern for M after the last freeze was pretty clear...

But Shelly said Euryale knows how dangerous Monica is...so maybe her concern was to get M thawed out before she burned her way out on her own, 'cause that carried the risk of mondo collateral damage.

[Bathorys Daughter]

I would say that Euryale was probably not in on any manipulation. Her concern for M after the last freeze was pretty clear...

But Shelly said Euryale knows how dangerous Monica is...so maybe her concern was to get M thawed out before she burned her way out on her own, 'cause that carried the risk of mondo collateral damage.

Good point. Monica, like Shelly, is just beginning to learn of her capabilities. That would include how to control them and not overdo it to the burning detriment of those in close proximity to an initial "flame-on" command. In fact it could be, like the other incidents, she doesn't have to think or do anything. It would have just happened.

[illiad]

Aging isn't harm in and of itself, but the effects of aging can be harmful.

But.. yes, you may be harmed, but still alive and 'healthy' ...
there was an old twilight zone (???) where they got eternal life, but continued to age.. they showed this couple, that had so many wrinkles, etc, they looked like they were 200 years old , wrinkles upon wrinkles, bent over, etc... but they just could not die...

[Dave11]

Oh dear. The confusion is getting worse by the day.

The confusion-corner is getting overcrowded too. I guess it's time for "Confusion-Ville" Where Wapsi-readers set-up tents, and ponder their collective bafflement.

Well. all in good time, I guess. There wíll be (some sort) of coherent explanation (I only hope I am intellectually capable enough to grasp it....)

Not to worry--the Confusion Corner is sufficiently mutiply-connected and high-dimensional (in M.C.Escher's sort of way) that there's room for all who need to use it.

So the Confusion Corner is like the Unseen University Library? Distorts reality enough to connect to "C-Space"?

[Fairportfan]

the other "Shelly's" were different people none of whom had Titan or Sphinx heritage. Some even had different names. The only similarity for them was Cherokee heritage.

Comanche, isn't it?

[kingklash]

the other "Shelly's" were different people none of whom had Titan or Sphinx heritage. Some even had different names. The only similarity for them was Cherokee heritage.

Comanche, isn't it?

It's Comanche. But Cherokee seems to be what pops into the general public's head these days. My brother told me that during his junior-college days, there were so many white students claiming Cherokee heritage to try and get some government benefits, and not looking even the tiniest bit Native American, that they were known as "Generokees."

[bmonk]

Thinking about it, Monica has been told that she won't let herself be harmed 'too seriously'.
This might mean that if she's stupid she could trip and break a leg, but she wouldn't break her neck.
When paying attention she wouldn't even stub her toe.

Or... bees can sneak up and sting her, and even when paying attention she can smack herself in the head with a pistol.

That may be a way to save her from the "Teela Brown" condition of awkwardness--according to Niven's theory, she never had to learn to be graceful to avoid minor injury, and so she was clumsy--but never fell or hurt herself as a result. This (Monica's method) seems more healthy and safer in the long run, since you never know when your luck will unfortunately fail.

[bmonk]

. . . the Confusion Corner is sufficiently mutiply-connected and high-dimensional (in M.C.Escher's sort of way) that there's room for all who need to use it.

So the Confusion Corner is like the Unseen University Library? Distorts reality enough to connect to "C-Space"?

<channel Curley>Soitenly!</channel> I suspect, if you find the right set of cushions, you only have to reach out to get the book you need. . . .

[Mark N]

the other "Shelly's" were different people none of whom had Titan or Sphinx heritage. Some even had different names. The only similarity for them was Cherokee heritage.

Comanche, isn't it?

You are correct apologize, I was half asleep when I wrote that and did not recheck my comment well. I'll turn myself into the leaders of the Comanche and Cherokee nations and beg forgiveness. lol